Accident in Northern Saskatchewan

[J.O.]

Initial reports saying it was a Westwind Aviation aircraft. The only aircraft in their fleet that would carry that many people is the ATR 42

https://globalnews.ca/news/3916092/multiple-injuries-in-plane-crash-near-fond-du-lac-sask/

Edited December 14, 2017 by J.O.

[Moon The Loon]

Plane carrying 25 people crashes near northern Sask. airport

RCMP says several people were injured in the early evening crash

CBC News · 23 minutes ago

A West Wind Aviation plane carrying 22 passengers and three crew members crashed near the Fond-du-Lac, Sask., airport shortly after takeoff early Wednesday night, according to the RCMP.

Several injuries were reported.

[Moon The Loon]

Plane carrying 25 people crashes near northern Saskatchewan airport

RCMP say several people were injured in the early evening crash near Fond-du-Lac airport

CBC News · 17 minutes ago

 

The plane crashed near the airport for Fond-du-Lac, a remote fly-in community in northern Saskatchewan. (Google Maps)

A West Wind Aviation plane carrying 22 passengers and three crew members crashed near the Fond-du-Lac, Sask., airport shortly after takeoff early Wednesday night, the RCMP says.

Several people were injured though no fatalities were reported, according to an RCMP news release issued shortly after 8 p.m. CST.

"The rescue effort is the priority right now," said RCMP spokesperson Paul Dederich. 

Officers from Stony Rapids are helping at the scene alongside local emergency responders.

"Additional emergency/rescue resources are on the way to the scene from Royal Canadian Air Force and Search and Rescue," the RCMP said in its release.

1 km from airstrip

RCMP members found the plane less than one kilometre from the airstrip. Fond-du-Lac is a remote fly-in community in the northern part of the province. 

 

The plane that crashed is an ATR-42, according to Rick Philipenko, the chief financial officer of Saskatoon-based West Wind Aviation.

"Right now our primary concern remains with the passenger and crew that we're trying to look after right now," said Philipenko

Transport Canada will be investigating the crash. 

[Moon The Loon]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatoon/plane-carrying-25-people-crash-northern-sask-1.4447787

[Kip Powick]

I have never flown the ATR but have heard it is a beast in icing conditions...

.Based on one single photo the only thing I see is that the flaps appear to be up.

Anyone know if that is a normal config for an ATR take-off ???

If it is not normal, isn't it unusual to have them up when the aircraft is still so close to the airport after takeoff??.

Probably have to wait 2+ years for this TSB report as well 

Ahhhh..More pictures at AVHerald and indeed, the flaps look they were NOT up...

 

Edited December 15, 2017 by Kip Powick
correction

[Airband]

fwiw:

Quote

"A few aircraft crashed in the early days because of the loss of lift of the wings caused by the accumulation of icing," he said.

Icing was considered a contributing factor in the 1991 crash. That accident also involved the ATR 72, which is bigger than the ATR 42.

"The reality is if you look at the accident, there was a bunch of changes that came out following that accident both to pilot procedure and aircraft systems," Speer said.

"The airplane today is not that same airplane they had," said Speer.

'Aviation experts defend safety record of type of plane used in Saskatchewan crash'

[Guest]

Photos on the TSB page https://www.flickr.com/photos/tsbcanada/

from them it appears that the flaps were not up or am I seeing it wrongly? 

From the hull breakup fwd of the wings it is amazing that there were no fatalities. 

[acsidestick]

In the TSB pictures, it appears the flaps are slightly extended.

Thank heavens for the forward cargo location on the ATR, or this would be a very different story.  It’s incredible to understand from the TSB pictures how the pilots could be relatively unscathed.

[blues deville]

Amazing there were no fatalities. And I would agree the flaps appear to be extended by the gap shown in the fairing below them. 

Canada’s north is scattered with DC3’s, C46’s and other older types. Overloaded planes, cold weather ops and engine failures. Nothing has really changed except the equipment we are using. Will be interesting to know the cause in this accident. 

[Seeker]

Not to jump the process but I'd be very surprised if icing didn't turn out to be a factor.

[Kasey]

2 hours ago, seeker said:

Not to jump the process but I'd be very surprised if icing didn't turn out to be a factor.

How about de-icing?

[Guest]

Aviation Investigation A17C0146

Collision with terrain

Updated: 15 December 2017

 

The occurrence

On 13 December 2017, a ATR42-320 operated by West Wind Aviation with 22 passengers and 3 crew on board collided with terrain shortly after take-off from the Fond-du-Lac Airport, Saskatchewan (ZFD) for a flight to Stony Rapids, Saskatchewan (YSF). The aircraft sustained substantial damage. A number of passengers and one crew member sustained serious injuries. The TSB is investigating.

Progress to date

There  is currently a TSB investigative team on site. Air investigators and technical experts from the TSB Engineering Laboratory have been deployed to the site. So far, the team has:

• Conducted the initial survey of the accident site;
• Taken photographs of the wreckage.
• Recovered and secured the Flight Data Recorder, Cockpit Voice Recorder, and Emergency Locator Transmitter.

What we know

• The aircraft descended into trees and terrain.
• The wreckage path is at least 800 feet long.
• The aircraft is in an upright position, but tilted steeply to the right.
• The left side of the aircraft appears to have the worst damage.
• The fuselage ruptured at about seating row number 3.

Safety action taken

• West Wind has grounded their other ATR aircraft for the time being.

Working with others

The TSB conducts independent investigations. In this investigation, the following agencies have sent representatives to the site:

• Bureau d'Enquêtes et d'Analyses pour la sécurité de l'aviation civile (BEA) (French investigative body)
• ATR (aircraft manufacturer)
• Pratt & Whitney Canada (engine manufacturer)
• Transport Canada (Minister's Observer)

We would also like to recognize the contribution of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) and the local Rangers who protected the site.

Next steps

In the coming days and weeks, among other activities, the team will

• Continue the site survey;
• Examine components such as instrumentation and any device that contains non-volatile memory;
• Gather additional information about weather conditions;
• Gather radar information;
• Obtain and examine aircraft maintenance records;
• Obtain and examine pilot training, qualifications and proficiency records;
• Interview witnesses, the aircraft operator and others;
• Review operational policies and procedures; and
• Examine the regulatory requirements.

Communication of safety deficiencies

Investigations are complex and we take the time needed to complete a thorough investigation. However, should the investigation team uncover safety deficiencies that present an immediate risk, the Board will communicate them without delay.

Further, it is important not to draw conclusions or speculate as to causes at this time. There are often many factors that can contribute to an accident.

Map of the area  http://www.tsb.gc.ca/eng/enquetes-investigations/aviation/2017/a17c0146/a17c0146.asp

[Seeker]

1 hour ago, Kasey said:

How about de-icing?

I know nothing about Westwind,  or the ATR for that matter, and therefore can't comment on what deicing procedures might have been available or in use.  

[Kip Powick]

Pardon me whilst I reminisce....deicing back "then"

Back in the dark ages I was a fledgling FO on the DC3, (Mil C-47), and stationed at RCAF station North Bay...One of our 140Kt TAS trips took us to Yarmouth NS for a night. The next morning my Captain felt we had to deice as there was just a light skim of ice on the leading edges and hoar frost on the wings.....

The trouble was there was no way to actually deice as deicing trucks and equipment had not really been  invented and if they had, all the real big airports had the equipment. Our crew man managed to find a small barrel of glycol in an old hanger and wheeled it out to the aircraft....but...how were we to apply ?

It was decided to get the lids from two garbage cans and pour 3 or 4 inches into the lids,then physically  back up to the leading edge of the wing, and flip it over our head with the intent to get the fluid on the leading edge and the remainder to run down the wing!!

And that is exactly what we did wearing our uniforms  and rain coats buttoned to the neck  to give us some protection from the obvious spillage. About an hour later Captain "Rickenbacker" and I took off and all was well and the tarty odour of the glycol was muted, to a degree, by keeping the side windows of the cockpit slightly open and putting winter parkas over our legs for warmth  and about an hour into the flight we  returned  to normal ops....

 

PS..that same Captain and I had another experience, (( which I wrote about called "The Gooney Bird Corkscrew" )), and when he retired about 3 years after I was posted to another unit he retired with the most hours a RCAF pilot had ever acquired on a DC3, (Mil C-47),  ...I believe it was in excess of 8000 hours. He was given a left seat of a DC3 as a retirement gift.

[Flightlevels]

Kinda looks like the prop is feathered on that left engine. (Or maybe just bent around) 

Glad everyone survived.

 

[blues deville]

7 hours ago, Flightlevels said:

Kinda looks like the prop is feathered on that left engine. (Or maybe just bent around)

 

Are you suggesting a repeat of the Trans Asia crash?

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/02/transasia-crash-pilot-pulled-wrong-throttle-shut-down-sole-engine

[acsidestick]

That’s my thought as well.  

The left isn’t curled, but twisted two different ways, possibly no power on at impact.  That can happen when it’s turning but no making power, hits an object (tree) then immediately reverses from the impact the other way and hits another object (tree), The passengers said one quit, then the other, then the impact.  

There is  only one reason both can quit so close together, and that’s fuel starvation.  

The reason for fuel starvation is limited to two reasons.  It did it, or you did it.  I sincerely hope it somehow did it, for whatever reason and that this is not a repeat of TransAsia 235.

[conehead]

Amazing picture...

 

[Kip Powick]

There is  only one reason both can quit so close together, and that’s fuel starvation.

What about an emergency/fire/flame-out  on one engine and then wrong engine being shut down................that scenario has happened.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Kip Powick said:

There is  only one reason both can quit so close together, and that’s fuel starvation.

What about an emergency/fire/flame-out  on one engine and then wrong engine being shut down................that scenario has happened.

I think that is what he said ... 

Quote

 

There is  only one reason both can quit so close together, and that’s fuel starvation.  

The reason for fuel starvation is limited to two reasons.  It did it, or you did it.  I sincerely hope it somehow did it, for whatever reason and that this is not a repeat of TransAsia 235.

 

 

[acsidestick]

Kip, that is exactly the scenario I was intimating.  As I said, I really hope I’m wrong.  Thanks Malcolm.

[Kip Powick]

1 hour ago, acsidestick said:

Kip, that is exactly the scenario I was intimating.  As I said, I really hope I’m wrong.  Thanks Malcolm.

Speed reading......missed the last/clinching line..my apologies

[AIP]

West Wind has a fantastic safety record, no accidents in recent memory.

I know it is in pilots nature to speculate, but perhaps it best to wait for the real information.

As always, there are peoples livelihoods at play.

 

[Vsplat]

4 hours ago, AIP said:

I know it is in pilots nature to speculate, but perhaps it best to wait for the real information.

As always, there are peoples livelihoods at play.

 

AIP, could not agree more.

Vs

Edited December 19, 2017 by Vsplat

[blues deville]

From Global news so......

https://globalnews.ca/news/3927833/tsb-plane-crash-northern-saskatchewan-transportation-safety-board/?utm_source=skies-daily-news-news-from-the-web&utm_campaign=skies-daily-news&utm_medium=email&utm_term=news-news-from-the-web&utm_content=V1