Our Transport Minister Does Not Have a Clue

[Guest2]

'Unacceptable': Transport minister critiques Via Rail situation as Christmas Day trains cancelled06:28

Passenger details Via Rails lack of communication

03:51

Passenger stuck on train for more than 12 hours

01:57

Via Rail passengers stranded for hours

06:09

Passengers stuck on train for 17 hours

Next

• Michael Lee
• CTVNews.ca Writer
• Follow | Contact

 

• More share options

Canada's transport minister took aim at Via Rail on Saturday after some passengers were left stranded overnight on stalled trains following the recent winter storm.

Riders have reported being stuck for as long as 18 hours on Via Rail trains. The Crown corporation says several trains on the Quebec City-Windsor corridor have been immobilized or cancelled "due to extreme weather conditions."

A travel alert posted on Via Rail's website Saturday says as many as 24 trains have been cancelled.

In another update Saturday evening, Via Rail said due to a CN train derailment earlier in the day, all trains between Toronto and Ottawa and between Toronto and Montreal that were scheduled to run on Christmas Day have been cancelled.

"The current situation with @VIA_Rail is unacceptable and we are in contact with them to resolve all issues safely and efficiently," federal Transport Minister Omar Alghabra said in a statement on Twitter Saturday. "The unprecedented weather has caused delays in our transportation system and the safety of passengers and crew is our top priority."

Alghabra's statement did not say exactly how the federal government is working to resolve the issue.

The issues involving Via Rail come after a winter storm swept across Canada on Friday and continued into Saturday, bringing with it snow, heavy winds and extreme cold.

Via Rail train 55 from Ottawa to Toronto in particular appeared to be impacted, stalling near Cobourg, Ont., due to a fallen tree, which blocked rail lines.

The Crown corporation told CP24 that while it couldn't say when the trains would start moving, customers will be compensated.

"We, however, deeply apologize for this situation and the impact for our passengers and we are continuing to work with our teams and the infrastructure owner to either get those trains moving as quickly as possible or bring them to their final destination with new equipment. Passengers who are travelling on these trains will be provided a full refund," the company said.

With files from CP24 web writer Joshua Freeman and CTVNews.ca writer Natasha O'Neill

[Innuendo]

Alghabra's statement did not say exactly how the federal government is working to resolve the issue.

I guess the Feds must have some kind of magic wand or expect the transportation industry to produce one.

I have to feel for the folk working outside at YYZ.

If I have got the WX report right it is minus 10 with the wind  29 gusting 35,( in knots!!).

Edited December 25, 2022 by Innuendo

[st27]

I find it odd that Algabra is suddenly concerned about VIA rail…..I guess he missed this article:

 

https://ottawacitizen.com/opinion/columnists/shron-via-rails-fleet-is-obsolete-cant-we-do-better

Quote

The oldest trains in VIA’s fleet are HEP-2 (Head End Power) cars. These were built between 1947 and 1953 for American streamliners. They were purchased secondhand and refurbished by Via in the 1990s without any extra government capital funding. These antique trains are not used out on quiet remote services. They are used on fast intercity trains in southern Ontario and Quebec. Some of our nation’s busiest trains are 70 years old, and this is a disgrace.

Via’s mismatched fleet requires expensive duplication of skills and materials for maintenance. It may be a rail enthusiast’s dream to ride on a 1940s’ passenger car between Toronto and Montreal, but for a national passenger railway it is an embarrassment. 

 

[Jaydee]

On 12/24/2022 at 7:48 PM, Skeptic said:

The current situation with @VIA_Rail is unacceptable and we are in contact with them to resolve all issues safely and efficiently,

I swear the entire cabinet reads from the same script with a few blanks to fill in pertinent details 

[Airband]

On 12/25/2022 at 9:54 PM, st27 said:

I find it odd that Algabra is suddenly concerned about VIA rail…..I guess he missed this article

Not to defend the minister's long list of shortcomings or VIA's other multiple deficiencies but the article about the aging fleet is over five years old and doesn't reflect federal budgeting for new trains (albeit diesel in an increasingly electrified world) was approved in 2018 and will be appearing on the corridor runs in the next few months.

 

 

[Guest2]

Are we seeing the results of people with no experience being put in charge of very important facets of our federal departments>'?

The Honourable Omar Alghabra, MP - Canada.ca

[conehead]

1 hour ago, Skeptic said:

Are we seeing the results of people with no experience being put in charge of very important facets of our federal departments>'?

The Honourable Omar Alghabra, MP - Canada.ca

The guy’s a mechanical engineer. He should have at least a clue.

[Seeker]

45 minutes ago, conehead said:

The guy’s a mechanical engineer. He should have at least a clue.

Not necessarily.  I have a family member who's an engineer and the stories he has to tell after 4 decades in the industry are shocking.

[Guest2]

52 minutes ago, conehead said:

The guy’s a mechanical engineer. He should have at least a clue.

Certainly not when it comes transportation. Not part of their studies or responsibilities.

Quote

What does a Mechanical Engineer do?

Mechanical Engineers design and develop new devices while also improving existing ones. They analyze the mechanical aspects of these products, focusing on heat transfer properties or durability. Through this, they come up with solutions that will meet industry standards while still being cost-effective enough to be produced at scale without affecting their price point too drastically.

What are the duties and responsibilities of a Mechanical Engineer?

Mechanical Engineers are responsible for analyzing mechanical and thermal devices to find solutions for repairs or innovations which will help solve even more complex challenges. They often handle developing prototypes suitable enough to be tested by customers until production begins.

What makes a Good Mechanical Engineer?

Successful Mechanical Engineers have math and science skills. They should enjoy working on complex problems that combine numbers with technological creativity. Using technology is also essential, as they will use various technological devices throughout their work.

Who does a Mechanical Engineer work with?

Mechanical Engineers work with Electrical Engineers. Each applies various engineering principles to improve upon multiple products within their field. As each of their specialties goes hand in hand, the two often find themselves collaborating.

 

[Seeker]

4 minutes ago, Skeptic said:

Certainly not when it comes transportation. Not part of their studies or responsibilities.

 

I think the general assumption about engineers (particularly mechanical engineers) is that the selection, training and eventual meeting of the qualification standards are "proof" of a high level of problem solving ability and underlying skills in logic, cost/benefit analysis, etc, etc.  Furthermore that these are universally useful abilities.

[Guest2]

35 minutes ago, Seeker said:

I think the general assumption about engineers (particularly mechanical engineers) is that the selection, training and eventual meeting of the qualification standards are "proof" of a high level of problem solving ability and underlying skills in logic, cost/benefit analysis, etc, etc.  Furthermore that these are universally useful abilities.

Perhaps but that does not qualify  someone, with no transportation knowledge to be the "Minister of Transportation" or indeed to be a licenced plumber, surgeon etc etc 

[conehead]

43 minutes ago, Seeker said:

I think the general assumption about engineers (particularly mechanical engineers) is that the selection, training and eventual meeting of the qualification standards are "proof" of a high level of problem solving ability and underlying skills in logic, cost/benefit analysis, etc, etc.  Furthermore that these are universally useful abilities.

Thank you Seeker. That’s exactly what I meant when I said he should have a clue. 

[Seeker]

17 minutes ago, Skeptic said:

Perhaps but that does not qualify  someone, with no transportation knowledge to be the "Minister of Transportation" or indeed to be a licenced plumber, surgeon etc etc 

You are correct but if I had to choose between an engineer or somebody with a BA in medieval poetry I'd choose the engineer.  Of course Minister Algebra has shown us it's still no guarantee of success.  

[Kip Powick]

OK...It is Christmas season and the Chief Admin has junped into the fray even though this thread has  a very political tangent.

ALL  APPROVED !!!

Happy New Year All 

 

 

[Seeker]

11 minutes ago, Kip Powick said:

OK...It is Christmas season and the Chief Admin has junped into the fray even though this thread has  a very political tangent.

Well, it is about the transport minister - seems close enough to be on topic.

[GDR]

24 minutes ago, Kip Powick said:

OK...It is Christmas season and the Chief Admin has junped into the fray even though this thread has  a very political tangent.

ALL  APPROVED !!!

Happy New Year All 

 

 

Have a great 2023 Kip. BTW, you seem to keep popping up at RAPCAN lunches all over Ont. Time you came out to YVR Island for one of those lunches.

Cheers

Greg

[Falken]

Not to worry, OMAR has an APP for this!

[Turbofan]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/air-passenger-bill-of-rights-reform-1.6724088
 

Omar is about to kick the airlines for the Christmas fiasco.  As far as accountability for airport authorities and nav services?  Doesn’t sound like he is interested.

 

Major travel disruptions last summer — and a problem-plagued Christmas travel season — have made it clear that reforms are necessary to better protect passengers from airlines that don't live up to their service standards, Alghabra told reporters on the sidelines of a federal cabinet retreat in Hamilton.

[Tango Foxtrot]

So The YVR Airport Service Provider not being the slightest bit prepared for winter operations is the airline's fault

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest1]

 

3 hours ago, Tango Foxtrot said:

So The YVR Airport Service Provider not being the slightest bit prepared for winter operations is the airline's fault

So I guess then AC is also to blame for the mess today and yesterday at Pearson.   

Hundreds of flights cancelled at Pearson

Pearson Airport reported on its website that more than 26 per cent of its departures and more than 27 per cent of its arrivals were cancelled by airlines on Wednesday.

"Delays and cancellations are expected so please check your flight status with your airline," the airport said.

[Tango Foxtrot]

Delays and cancelations are inevitable. Have a few more of these around, and a plan in place, people won't be stuck out on the ramp all day. Buy the blades and find somebody that has the loaders, and operators unused in the winter.   

 

 How much does it cost an Airport Service Provider to cancel every flight for three days. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Leeroy]

Just landed YWG, 23:15 local. Everything snow covered, saw one little bobcat by the terminal, no plows or sweepers on runways, taxiways, or aprons. 

[Turbofan]

3 hours ago, Tango Foxtrot said:

How much does it cost an Airport Service Provider to cancel every flight for three days. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Probably not a lot.  Most of those people will still pass through eventually and pay their AIF.

Take YOW for example.  No all weather capabilities.  Does it cost them when airlines can't land?  Not much because the people and planes simply pass through later.  The cost is mostly eaten by the airline.  So what is their incentive to pay for something that may very well reduce income?

There is no incentive to protect the operation from every once in awhile events.  The incentive is to save on the cost of snowplows, labor.  Just let the mess happen. Once it's over collect your AIF, albeit a little delayed.  For the airport authority this is more cost effective than snowplows, Cat 2 approaches, taxiway lighting that meets low visibility requirements.

[GreatSlave]

For a "winter" country that once walked with a degree of swagger over our superior survival capabilities, we have lately become quite helpless in the face of a few snowflakes (the meteorological kind).

[Turbofan]

1 hour ago, GreatSlave said:

For a "winter" country that once walked with a degree of swagger over our superior survival capabilities, we have lately become quite helpless in the face of a few snowflakes (the meteorological kind).

And it's not going to get better.  There doesn't seem to be any indication that changes will be made that will incentivize airport authorities to provide all weather capabilities.  

Wether that is a snow plow, a snow plow driver or a CAT II or III approach.  Not going to happen until government changes the structure to either incentivize through carrot or hammer.

Proof in the pudding that nothing is going to get addressed was when one airport authority was asked who's fault is it when aircraft can't take off because snow hasn't been removed?

Answer:. The airline because the pilot makes the final decision.

Translation.  Not my problem