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Who is the ground handler at Gatwick?  Are they any good?  Do they have experience on type?

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43 minutes ago, conehead said:

Who is the ground handler at Gatwick?  Are they any good?  Do they have experience on type?

I don't know but of all the travails that WJ has suffered with the 767, ground handling hasn't really been one...

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gatwick is actually a pretty decent airport to operate out of.  They handle all sorts of international traffic.  I am sure the 787 has been there alot.  in fact didnt one catch fire there a few years ago.

 

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32 minutes ago, boestar said:

 

gatwick is actually a pretty decent airport to operate out of.  They handle all sorts of international traffic.  I am sure the 787 has been there alot.  in fact didnt one catch fire there a few years ago.

 

787 fire was at LHR. Sat quarantined in BA’s hanger for awhile.

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Norwegian and Quatar operate to LGW regularly

 

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16 hours ago, Malcolm said:

I well know that but containers off / containers on.  Grooming and then  of course catering off and catering on.   Then guests etc etc  Thus my question re if 2hrs was realistic for that type of aircraft at an overseas point requiring full replenishing

We regularly turn a 333 in an hour.

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33 minutes ago, Rich Pulman said:

We regularly turn a 333 in an hour.

Thanks Rich. So the whole process for WestJet has the potential to work well.  I guess any rough spots will be worked out during the kickoff YYC-YYZ routing.

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Just curious Rich.....how many guys are working the ramp and how many groomers are in the cabin?

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3 hours ago, st27 said:

Just curious Rich.....how many guys are working the ramp and how many groomers are in the cabin?

To add to the question, do your pilots assist in the grooming?  And for the WestJetters on this forum, will WestJet pilots assist with the groom or is that no longer done?

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9 hours ago, st27 said:

Just curious Rich.....how many guys are working the ramp and how many groomers are in the cabin?

No idea. I’m usually too busy doing pilot stuff to notice.

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From CUPE:

 

MAINLINE: Grooming Update

The Pilots’ contract which came into effect just before the holidays has caused some impact on the line directly impacting Flight Attendants. Following the advice of their own union, Pilots are completing their safety duties before "volunteering" to assist with grooming. WestJet has asked Flight Attendants to “write up” Pilots who do not "volunteer" for this work. The Pilots’ contract does not include language directing them to clean the aircraft on a complimentary basis.

Flight Attendants have made it very clear to the Local 4070 Executive that they will not accept being accountable for unpaid cleaning of the company fleet on an ongoing basis.

There have been little to no documented rules, contract/agreements or even informal documents by the company which identify who is responsible for, and when voluntary cleaning of the aircraft is to take place.

We will start bargaining for our own contract in March. If Pilots are pressured into doing unpaid grooming, it will make it much more difficult for us to take our position forward (that the work is outside our scope and should be compensated regardless).

By completing their safety duties first, our Pilots are helping us set the stage for our own battle on the issue.

We urge our membership to rally together, Pilots and Cabin Crew, to ensure that the temporary setbacks we feel now, lead to success down the line.

In short, we are asking the following of you:

• Continue to groom as normal, until we can get the issue to the bargaining table. We cannot legally engage in job action at this time.
• Please do not "write up" Pilots. That adds pressure on the Pilots to give in, which will hurt our cause down the line.
• Try to work with Pilots and be united. Our interests are joined on this issue.
• Let CUPE stewards know if there are conflicts with Pilots that need to be resolved. We will discuss matters with ALPA and try to resolve them amicably.

Please make every effort to unite with our ALPA members, and do not help foster division even when they can’t help us clean up in the back. It is in our own best interests in the long run

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Like all good things that come to an end, that big jug of teal Kool-aid finally ran dry. :)

Edited by blues deville
My fact checker Kip thanks

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And this is how a company culture is eroded.  Just add union

 

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4 hours ago, boestar said:

And this is how a company culture is eroded.  Just add union

 

Which would not be there unless the employees wanted it and that is   because the corporation lost touch with their fellow (employees) owners

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WJ introduced a couple of new concepts to the piloting world that I thought were pretty good ideas such as leather jackets etc., but I thought the grooming policy demeaned the profession and I'm glad to see the practice is finally falling out of favour.

 

 

 

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One WS concept I’ve never understood is why they do not follow the manufacturer’s proven method of either PF or PM calling out all FMA’s as they are displayed. It does create some extra chatter but it alerts both pilots to any mode changes. I like and appreciate people who think ‘outside the box’ but this appears to be a lazy transistion from the -200s to the NG.

Edited by blues deville

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4 hours ago, DEFCON said:

WJ introduced a couple of new concepts to the piloting world that I thought were pretty good ideas such as leather jackets etc., but I thought the grooming policy demeaned the profession and I'm glad to see the practice is finally falling out of favour.

 

 

 

Far from a new concept.  it was done back in the golden age as well.  As the premadonnas took hole the duty fell by the wayside.  right along with the leather jackets.

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9 hours ago, DEFCON said:

WJ introduced a couple of new concepts to the piloting world that I thought were pretty good ideas such as leather jackets etc., but I thought the grooming policy demeaned the profession and I'm glad to see the practice is finally falling out of favour.

 

 

 

If you don't understand why the pilots - along with FA's and those employee flying non-rev all chipped in to help groom the aircraft, then you don't understand the philosophy of WestJet (at least the old school philosophy)  By the way, in my opinion, thinking that it's demeaning to pilots for helping turn the aircraft is pompous, arrogant and insulting.

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I don’t think it’s any of those things really. Sure if you have time, delayed etc however as a flight crew member at the airline level you’re primary job is to safely fly the aircraft. If anything should happen to you while you’re not performing you’re primary function it can jeopardize the flight and that can cost a lot more than a groomer’s hourly rate.

Most young pilots at some time early in their career have had to deice, clean or load their aircraft. Me too and I broke my tail bone backing into a 45 gal drum as I cinched up some tie-down ropes. I don’t know what giving birth is like but that was painful and one sore day of flying. But at that level of the industry you were expected to do your share of heavy lifting. 

I’ve done the groomer’s job and I was quick at it. I never expected one of those ‘Delta’ pilots to help me fold 200 seatbelts in the back of a 727. (Actually DL’s policy was not to fold them. Instead they were pulled straight down over the seat cushion edge. Why? Someone sued the airline because they sat down on the crossed straps/buckle and broke their .........tailbone.)

Once upon a time WS paid everyone entry level pay scales and it was “all hands on deck” to make it work and succeed. And it did. Now with more complex flight schedules and expanding route structure there are people assigned to do all the jobs and get an airplane on its way. 

 

Edited by blues deville
My spell checker Kip. Thanks

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11 hours ago, internet said:

If you don't understand why the pilots - along with FA's and those employee flying non-rev all chipped in to help groom the aircraft, then you don't understand the philosophy of WestJet (at least the old school philosophy)  By the way, in my opinion, thinking that it's demeaning to pilots for helping turn the aircraft is pompous, arrogant and insulting.

I think the demeaning part of it is that they are expected to do it for free.

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