Kip Powick Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Do you think that when individuals immigrate to Canada and become a Canadian citizen they should have to give up their citizenship of any other countries for which they may hold citizenship?? In other words..... if you become a Canadian citizen the only Passport you can legally have is a Canadian Passport. Just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fido Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Do you think that when individuals immigrate to Canada and become a Canadian citizen they should have to give up their citizenship of any other countries for which they may hold citizenship?? In other words..... if you become a Canadian citizen the only Passport you can legally have is a Canadian Passport. Just curious. Abso-friggen-lutely. I know of people like my family doctor who made this decision completely on their own and are proud of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustainable Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel. Samuel Johnson (1709 - 1784), quoted in Boswell's Life of Johnson It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. Mark Twain (1835 - 1910), Following the Equator (1897) Be careful in revising those immigration laws of yours. We got careless with ours. advice given to Herbert Humphrey by an American Indian from New Mexico I'm agin it. Plus, there are too many retired Canadian politicans living in Mexico for this notion to get too far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 One should have to make a real commitment when becoming a citizen of Canada and that must include giving up your former citizenship. If you are not prepared to do that, then perhaps you are also not prepared to make a real commitment either. On the flip side, Citizens of Canada who chose to take out citizenship of a another country, should automatically lose their Canadian Citizenship as they no longer have a real commitment to Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon The Loon Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 There is an inherent contradiction though with the basic idea and that is Country of Birth. Perhaps the importance placed on this fact by the world community is now outdated. Country of Birth currently guarantees a right to citizenship in that country (there are probably exceptions to this all encompassing statement). There are some countries in the world which, by their own laws, refuse the right of their citizens to relinquish their citizenship no matter what other country those people may have emigrated to or become citizens of. So the argument posed by Kip's question becomes circular. Maybe what we should be asking is what extra commitments should we as Canadians demand of newly sworn citizens, either in the form of an oath reinforced by strong penalties if broken (remember the word "treason"?) or the stripping of citizenship and extradition of individuals based upon new laws not yet contemplated. Then, returning to the circular argument, what becomes the status of children of immigrant citizens who are born here but who's parents are extradited under the yet to be developed laws? Whichever way we go about "protecting" our society from outsiders, because that is what the question is really asking, we will end up changing our society fundamentally. To do this will require the consent of Canadians in the form of representation to our various levels of government. Whereas every citizen is eligible to fulfil one of these representative roles, we could feasibly have an entire government made up of immigrants who are citizens. How would this theoretical government feel about stripping themselves of any secondary citizenship they may individually hold? Stephane Dion is a good example to highlight the co-existing contradiction of public indignation and indifference to the whole idea of dual citizenship held by, in this example, politicians. Kip, I think the question might be too simple and may result in predominently emotional responses. Except mine, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I think any landed immigrant that gains Canadian citizenship then spends more than 180 days a year outside of Canada should then automatically lose that citizenship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted February 19, 2007 Author Share Posted February 19, 2007 Whichever way we go about "protecting" our society from outsiders, because that is what the question is really asking I don't think the question is asking for any "protectionism" at all, either you support being only a Canadian or you don't. Kip, I think the question might be too simple and may result in predominently emotional responses A simple question begs a simple answer . That is one of the problems in todays society............too much "deep" thinking and "what-ifs", and of course we sure as hell don't want to offend anyone......after all we are Canadian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sustainable Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Fer Cryin' out loud.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question begging the question DOES NOT MEAN to ask for a question to be posed!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted February 19, 2007 Author Share Posted February 19, 2007 Fer Cryin' out loud.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question begging the question DOES NOT MEAN to ask for a question to be posed!!!!!!! Fer Cryin' out loud.... I believe I posted...... simple question begs a simple answer or is your remark for someone else....I'm a little confused.... and if you still find fault....how about......? I posed a simple question...I would like a simple answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airband Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I think any landed immigrant that gains Canadian citizenship then spends more than 180 days a year outside of Canada should then automatically lose that citizenship. Cool, b-scale citizenship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chockalicious Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I am not sure that there is a cut and dried answer to this. This issue has been in the news here in YYC lately with the reference being to all the Canadian passport holders in Lebanon who needed to be evacuated during the incidents there last year. Many of the passport holders had not set foot in Canada for years however were screaming for Canadian help. Maybe we nood to look at some sort of residency vs citizenship laws. There was one university prof who proposed an extra cost for non resident passport holders. How do you get around the issue of Chinese nationals who become Canadian citizens yet China still recognizes them as citizens? Do you penalize them for having 2 passports? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deicer Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 How do you get around the issue of Chinese nationals who become Canadian citizens yet China still recognizes them as citizens? Do you penalize them for having 2 passports? It's like luvin the wife and girfriend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Cool, b-scale citizenship. Would it not solve the problem of citizen by convenience? Where they get a passport and return to countries like Lebanon then at the first sign of trouble, politically or medically they become a Canadian again! In some countries they protect the nation by only allowing citizenship to those born in country to current citizens. All others get work visa's etc and receive benefits only while in country. So what would be so wrong with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 How do you get around the issue of Chinese nationals who become Canadian citizens yet China still recognizes them as citizens? Do you penalize them for having 2 passports? You force them to give up the other passport. If they travel under the other passport then they lose the Canadian passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goonybird Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Rather than force people to make a choice of citizenship, we should tax people on their Canadian citizenship rather than residency. When a Canadian chooses to live outside of Canada for a prolonged period they should have to pay a certain amount of Canadian tax in return for consular services. If you are not interested in paying the taxes then you can forfiet your Canadian citizenship. Americans are taxed on citizenship, not residency and it works reasonably well. FYI I am a dual citizen and have also been an expat that would have been subject to such a tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lakelad Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Would it not solve the problem of citizen by convenience? Where they get a passport and return to countries like Lebanon then at the first sign of trouble, politically or medically they become a Canadian again! But a Canadian born citizen similarly working/retiring offshore would be entitled to play that same medical, political 'come get me' card denied these lesser citizens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 But a Canadian born citizen similarly working/retiring offshore would be entitled to play that same medical, political 'come get me' card denied these lesser citizens? These "lesser" citizens are only equal citizens in my opinion when they give up their former citizenship. As for Goonybirds comments...I agree! Offer a tax-free bracket like the USA and tax everything else. Both these options would stop the citizen of convenience issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AME Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Rather than force people to make a choice of citizenship, we should tax people on their Canadian citizenship rather than residency. When a Canadian chooses to live outside of Canada for a prolonged period they should have to pay a certain amount of Canadian tax in return for consular services. If you are not interested in paying the taxes then you can forfiet your Canadian citizenship. Americans are taxed on citizenship, not residency and it works reasonably well. FYI I am a dual citizen and have also been an expat that would have been subject to such a tax. I live here and I don't what to pay the damn taxes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Specs Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 The Oath of citizenenship is "I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfill my duties as a Canadian citizen. " Call it a hunch but I guess some on here would propose a few changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 The Oath of citizenenship is "I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfill my duties as a Canadian citizen. " Call it a hunch but I guess some on here would propose a few changes. Nope...just enforcement! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Nope...just enforcement! faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfill my duties as a Canadian citizen. " if only we could get all of us born here to agree to that also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon The Loon Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 I don't think the question is asking for any "protectionism" at all, either you support being only a Canadian or you don't. A simple question begs a simple answer . That is one of the problems in todays society............too much "deep" thinking and "what-ifs", and of course we sure as hell don't want to offend anyone......after all we are Canadian. Aw, c'mon Kip! The idea of isolating one's self in any way, shape or form is the very definition of protectionism. Simple answer? You didn't ask a simple question! Does God Exist has spawned libraries of answers; has started countless wars; continues to divide billions of people. But it is such a simple question. Have you stopped beating your wife? It's not the answer that counts, it's the Question. Sooooooo... perhaps you already have an answer that you haven't offered to us yet! The Devil is in the Details... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted February 20, 2007 Author Share Posted February 20, 2007 Simple answer? You didn't ask a simple question! My Question............. Do you think that when individuals immigrate to Canada and become a Canadian citizen they should have to give up their citizenship of any other countries for which they may hold citizenship?? My SIMPLE ANSWER Yes.. Jeeese whats so difficult about coming up with a SIMPLE YES or NO??????????? I really don't give a rat's rosey red rear about all the reasons why, or why not you may feel the way you do, don't want a myriad of reasons, and assumable ramifications...just a simple answer for the damned question. Does God Exist has spawned libraries of answers Do you not think most people can answer that question with a simple "yes" or "no" in their own mind?? The fact that thousands of libraries have been spawned is just indicative of persons attempting to justify their answer or perhaps muddy the thinking of those that have arrived at a definitive answer but in this case, my simple question, asked for a simple answer and I would have been very happy with just "yes" or "no" answers. Do you see what I am trying to say...in the post?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deicer Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Do you think that when individuals immigrate to Canada and become a Canadian citizen they should have to give up their citizenship of any other countries for which they may hold citizenship?? Yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.O. Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Sheesh! I feel like I'm listening to Lemmon and Matthau all over again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.