20 years for importing marijuana

[Kip Powick]

I don't want to debate this young ladies guilt or innocence but rather focus on the penalty imposed. Personally I would like to see stiffer penalties for all drug related crimes but only in Canada do we say "aw shucks" we don't want to scare anyone with stiff penalties.

Jakarta — An Indonesian court on Friday convicted an Australian beauty school student of smuggling marijuana on Bali island and sentenced her to 20 years in prison, drawing cries of outrage from relatives at a trial that attracted massive attention in Australia.

Schapelle Corby, 27, who insists she is innocent and that the drugs were planted in her luggage, wept as the verdict was announced and mouthed “Just relax” to her parents. Her mother Rosleigh Rose yelled out “liar, liar” while other relatives yelled “We are going to get you home. We love you.”

“Judges are of the opinion that the accused imported marijuana,” Judge Wayan Suastrawan said. “She was arrested red-handed at the airport.”

After judges issued the sentence, Ms. Corby was allowed to hug her weeping parents before being led away by police to jail. Outside the courtroom, Ms. Corby's sister Mercedes said the family would appeal the verdict.

“This is not fair,” she yelled. “We will get Schapelle home.”

The court was packed with dozens of Australian journalists, Corby supporters and her relatives, including her mother and father.

Ms. Corby was convicted of smuggling 4.1 kilograms of marijuana into Bali's airport last year in her surfboard bag. Ms. Corby could have faced a maximum penalty of death, and prosecutors had requested a life sentence.

Ms. Corby's lawyers allege that the drugs were planted by airport baggage handlers in Australia as part of a drug smuggling operation and that they ended up in Bali by mistake.

Ahead of the court hearing, her lawyer said Ms. Corby was “terrified.”

“She's probably the worst I've ever seen her,” Ms. Corby's lawyer Robin Tampoe told Australian television's Nine Network.

“She tries to put on a brave face but there was a lot of crying, she's pretty well terrified about the worst case scenario, what might happen today, so it's very hard to console her in that sort of situation.”

Ms. Corby's plight attracted massive media attention in Australia, where opinion polls show that many people are convinced she is innocent.

The guilty verdict and lengthy sentence were likely to trigger anger in Australia and could complicate relations between the two Asian neighbours.

Ms. Corby's parents as well as several Australian tourists visited the jail Thursday to show their support and joined her on Friday to hear the verdict.

“She doesn't seem like the kind of person who would do something like that. Why would anyone risk their life for $4,000 or $5,000?” said Ron Reilly, a tourist from the Australian town of Freemantle standing outside the courtroom. “I am convinced she is innocent. The more friendly faces she sees today will give her a boost.”

The Australian government asked prosecutors not to hand down the death sentence and said it wants to negotiate a deal with Jakarta to allow her to serve any prison sentence back home.

Jakarta says it does not want to sign an agreement that would apply only for Ms. Corby because that would set a precedent that it fears other countries might take advantage of.

Ms. Corby draws little sympathy in Indonesia, where the government is under pressure to crack down on illegal drug use. She is one of dozens of foreigners jailed in the country each year on drug charges.

[deicer]

There is a two pronged issue going on here in my opinion.

First of all, marijuana is still an illegal drug, and therefore should be dealt with appropriately by police forces, and the judicial system. I know that certain parts of the world treat is more seriously, but 20 years is a little harsh.....

On the other hand, alcohol is a drug as well. One that is condoned because of the high taxation levels by most governments. It has its problems, addictions and impact on our society, yet they are bypassed due to the revenue that it generates.

Which is the greater of two evils

Let's just say that I have never seen anyone want to trash a bar after smoking a couple of joints

Iceman

[Guest rattler]

If you do the crime, you must serve the time. If the crime is committed in another country, then don't cry when the punishment is harsher than you would receive at home.

As far as our penalties, .... trafficking in hard drugs should be treated the same as committing murder. The end result to the victim is much the same, once hooked their life is destroyed.

The problem is the same no matter where you live in the world. Hard drugs are illegal in most countries but do generate considerable amounts of cash for the criminal element. Perhaps the only solution is to make drug use legal and sell the products to adults through liquor outlets but that approach has a couple of hidden dangers: 1. if legal, folks would try the drug as it was now legal.

2. Drug usage would also spread to those under the "legal age" in the same fashion as alcohol usage does now.

So, it would seem to me that the only path to tread would be to invoke harsher penalties for those who sell the illegal drugs, perhaps mandatory life with no appeal. This would dissuade some but not all.

[handyman]

... but 20 years is a little harsh.....

No it's not. If we had harsh penalties for drug trafficking we would see a reduction in not only drug trafficking but other crimes as well.

That being said, in this case I believe she is innocent and the law went way too far.

[Mitch Cronin]

But not all "drug related crimes", or more to the point, not all drugs, are alike Kip.

Twenty years for pot is absolutely NUTS! Not only is it less harmful than alcohol, it's probably less harmful than tobacco for Pete sakes! Being called a "drug" doesn't mean it's the same as heroine. There are huge, and very meaningful differences. Lumping pot in with the same group as other, much more wicked "drugs" is flat out wrong.

If she's guilty, she should have got no more penalty than if she'd been smuggling wine.

....now why do I smell a clip from some article Rattler finds on the internet coming?

If my nose is right Rattler, I could find you just as many papers written by learned men espousing my point of view, so how 'bout we save the bandwidth? The thing is, you'll never know for sure unless you've been there and done that. As one who has, I know something of what I speak.

I can tell you with absolute sincerity that I'd be much happier to see my children in the hands of someone who smokes pot but never drinks, than one who drinks but never smokes pot.

When alcohol is illegal, we'll talk again.

....and if my nose was wrong, please understand that no offense was intended Rattler. ... I just had a feeling that maybe we'd tried a few footsteps on this trail once before?.

[Mitch Cronin]

Geez I type slow... just saw the last two responses before mine... THANK YOU RATTLER! ...for recognizing, and emphasizing the difference between marijuana and hard drugs

...as for you cpdude... sigh... I see you're one of the confused ones. If selling a bag of pot is the same to you as selling heroine - "Drug trafficking" - than how do you see the stores that sell cigarettes, or beer?

Cheers,

Mitch

[CD]

...but 20 years is a little harsh.....

It beats the death sentence, which is what she was facing.

[handyman]

I see you're one of the confused ones. If selling a bag of pot is the same to you as selling heroine - "Drug trafficking" - than how do you see the stores that sell cigarettes, or beer?

But Mitch, I hope you realize that pot today is over 100 times more potent than the pot which was available when we were young. Look at all the crime associated with pot. Shootings, BNE etc etc. Now I know what your going to say...legalize pot. But what makes you think the crimes wouldn't continue as gangs fight for market share? No, pot is a problem drug and although other drugs may be more harmful to the body, pot is just as harmful to the well being of all citizens.

As for cigarettes and beer...they are not as harmful to the body or society. Only in large volumes and over a long period of time can they be as harmful as pot to the body. But then the same could be said for vanilla extract!

[Guest rattler]

But not all "drug related crimes", or more to the point, not all drugs, are alike Kip.

Twenty years for pot is absolutely NUTS! Not only is it less harmful than alcohol, it's probably less harmful than tobacco for Pete sakes! Being called a "drug" doesn't mean it's the same as heroine. There are huge, and very meaningful differences. Lumping pot in with the same group as other, much more wicked "drugs" is flat out wrong. 

If she's guilty, she should have got no more penalty than if she'd been smuggling wine.

....now why do I smell a clip from some article Rattler finds on the internet coming? 

If my nose is right Rattler, I could find you just as many papers written by learned men espousing my point of view, so how 'bout we save the bandwidth? The thing is, you'll never know for sure unless you've been there and done that. As one who has, I know something of what I speak.

I can tell you with absolute sincerity that I'd be much happier to see my children in the hands of someone who smokes pot but never drinks, than one who drinks but never smokes pot.

When alcohol is illegal, we'll talk again. 

....and if my nose was wrong, please understand that no offense was intended Rattler. ... I just had a feeling that maybe we'd tried a few footsteps on this trail once before?.

So I guess your reply was direcect to "deicer" ?????? A lack of coffee or ???

[deicer]

. Drug usage would also spread to those under the "legal age" in the same fashion as alcohol usage does now.

Rattler

You have given away your age, and the fact that you don't have any children in the school system.

Kids nowadays don't drink like we used to. Pot and extasy are the mood altering substances of choice in schools these days. Very little alcohol is partaken due to the fact that it has to be obtained from the "government" store.

CPdude

If they were to distribute pot through the gov channels, then the issue of strength would be nul and void. You would have "Pot" and "Pot Lite" sold in regulated concentrations much like you have beer, wine and liquor having to be at certain strengths now.

Yes, you will always have the illegal high grade pot, but isn't that the equivalent of what "moonshine" used to be?

We are at the same crossroads as earlier this century with prohibition. It just takes a sensible grown up government to realise what is going on and to address the problems posed by HARD drugs.

Cheers

Iceman

[Guest rattler]

Rattler

You have given away your age, and the fact that you don't have any children in the school system.

Kids nowadays don't drink like we used to. Pot and extasy are the mood altering substances of choice in schools these days. Very little alcohol is partaken due to the fact that it has to be obtained from the "government" store.

Not sure which area of Canada you live in but perhaps the following article will serve to show why I made my statement re teen drinking.

Alcohol: The Most Abused Drug in Canada

... Get the Facts About Your Kids and Drugs!

With heavy weekend drinking growing rapidly among our nation’s youth, parents must teach kids at an early age that alcohol is, first and foremost, a drug... as dangerous as any illegal drug. And beer or wine is no less harmful than liquor. The fact is, one bottle of beer or glass of wine has the same alcohol content as one shot of whisky.

PHYSICAL EFFECTS

Heavy alcohol use can take a great toll on the body. If a large enough quantity is consumed in a short amount of time, the brain’s ability to control breathing and heart rate may be harmed -- and death may occur.

Effects of heavy drinking for a number of years include severe damage to the liver, heart and pancreas; and an increased risk of cancer of the mouth, larynx, esophagus and liver. Heavy drinking may lead to malnutrition, stomach irritation, lower resistance to diseases, and irreversible brain and nervous system damage. On the average, the life span of a heavy drinker is shortened 10 to 12 years.

Alcohol problems are not limited to heavy drinking. About half of all alcohol problems occur among social drinkers.

Increasing among teenage drinkers is the use of other drugs in combination. When marijuana is used with alcohol, the dangers are greatly increased. Quaaludes and barbiturates increase the depressant effects of alcohol, leading to stupor, possible coma, even respiratory and heart failure.

FETAL ALCOHOL SYNDROME

For pregnant women, alcohol use can be especially dangerous, possibly resulting in spontaneous abortions, or children with slow growth, birth defects, and learning and behavioural disorders. Women who drink during pregnancy run the risk of having children with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome (FAS), which includes physical problems and irreversible intellectual disabilities.

ALCOHOL, KIDS AND CARS

Drinking and driving can be fatal. Nationwide, drivers between the ages of 16 and 19 account for 23 per cent of all traffic fatalities and 18 per cent of traffic injuries related to drinking and driving. Yet this group constitutes only 15 per cent of drinking drivers. In fact, alcohol-related

traffic fatalities are among the leading causes of death among 16- to 19-year-olds.

ALCOHOLISM

The need to drink before facing certain situations, frequent drinking binges, a steady increase in drinking, drinking alone, early morning drinking -- these are some of the warning signs of alcoholism, a disease that affects over half a million Canadians. The alcoholic tears apart families and careers, unable to control his or her drinking. It is a problem that gets progressively worse, and is potentially fatal. Treatment is extremely effective, but prevention is better.

WHAT A PARENT CAN DO

In Canada, 83 per cent of all teenagers use alcohol, and five per cent of Canadian teenagers have five or more drinks at a single sitting, four or more times per month. Parents can be a strong force in lowering these frightening statistics.

With the average beginning age of alcohol use at about 13, and the average age of teenage drinking on a regular basis at 16, parents must reach their children at nine or ten. Young people should be strongly encouraged not to drink because of the dangers associated with this drug.

Parents should keep an open line of communication, serve as role models, and provide emotional support and a loving family life. As children enter the age where there will be pressure to drink, you should be firm with them about alcohol use.

Communicate. Don’t hesitate to call the parents of your children’s friends. Find out if, indeed, they will be there to chaperon a party. Let them know you don’t appreciate liquor, or even beer, being allowed. Let your children know the consequences of attending a party where alcohol is

being served.

Find out when dances and parties will be over. Make sure your children are where they said they’d be. And keep a sharp eye on your own liquor supply.

YOUR KIDS AND DRUGS -- SPOT IT/STOP IT

As part of Shoppers Drug Mart/Pharmaprix’s new program, "Your Kids and Drugs -- Spot It/Stop It," the pharmacists at Shoppers Drug Mart/Pharmaprix have prepared a series of informative free pamphlets.

In addition to their pamphlet on alcohol, reprinted here, pamphlets are also available at the prescription counter of every Shoppers Drug Mart/Pharmaprix store on marijuana, cocaine, other illegal drugs, how to spot drug use, and how to protect your child from drug use.

WHERE PARENTS CAN TURN TO FOR HELP

Your provincial or local alcohol or drug abuse authority will be able to tell you where to find professional help in your area, if you should find you need assistance in controlling a drug or alcohol problem. Many parents have found that they can be more successful in keeping their

children drug free by working together with other concerned parents in their community. These parent groups can be found in almost any neighbourhood across the country. To find out more about parent groups, contact these organizations.

(This information was originally printed by Shoppers Drug Mart Limited and is reprinted here with permission. For more information, contact them at (416) 493-1220 or call one of the resources below. You may also contact your local drug or alcohol abuse centre.)

RESOURCES:

CODA (Council on Drug Abuse)

Toronto, Ontario

(416) 763-1491

Addiction Research Foundation

Toronto, Ontario

(416) 595-6000

Alcohol & Drug Concerns Inc.

Scarborough, Ontario

(416) 293-3400

PRIDE CANADA Inc.

Saskatoon, Saskatchewan

(306) 975-3755

1-800-667-3747

Bureau de Consultation Jeunesse

Montreal, Quebec

(514) 844-1737

Narcotics Anonymous

Montreal, Quebec

(514) 844-3092

Groupes familiaux NAR-ANON

(aide aux familles)

Montreal, Quebec

(514) 643-3903

ASPA

Montreal, Quebec

(514) 324-6662

[handyman]

If they were to distribute pot through the gov channels, then the issue of strength would be nul and void. You would have "Pot" and "Pot Lite" sold in regulated concentrations much like you have beer, wine and liquor having to be at certain strengths now.

Yes, you will always have the illegal high grade pot, but isn't that the equivalent of what "moonshine" used to be?

So this is the latest line in the sand? Where to next? In 10 years time why don't we legalize harder drugs since so many are doing it and saturating our court system? What makes you think this isn't a step towards full decriminalization of all drugs?

[deicer]

Rattler

In no way am I minimising the effects or the severity of what you are saying. I live in the Greater Toronto Area and from what I see in my area, alcohol isn't the major problem.

As with all statistics, maybe this needs to be updated?

When you speak of drugs harming children, look at the amount of caffeine that they are ingesting these days. Colas, sport drinks, "enhancement" drinks like Red Bull, etc.

As I said above, we need a mature responsible government that will take this all into account and come up with policies to control substances.

Wasn't it in YWG that they took Lysol off the shelves in certain area's to keep it away from youth and other elements of society?

We have to look at the big picture, and not micromanage this issue.

Iceman

[deicer]

So this is the latest line in the sand? Where to next? In 10 years time why don't we legalize harder drugs since so many are doing it and saturating our court system? What makes you think this isn't a step towards full decriminalization of all drugs?

Just as a question, what makes pot worse than alcohol?

[Super 80]

A friend of mine who spends alot of time in S.E. Asia will not check ANY bags and will not let her carry-on out of her sight.

You can't declare war on a commodity, all it does is result in a culture of redemption through escalation.

The drug war can NOT be won for a number of reasons.

A: Economics, the drug lords can't lose. More effective drug inforcement, the price of their wares rises and they win. Ineffective drug inforcement the price falls the volume of their wares increases and they win.

B: The balance of penalties, drug lords are virtually always untouchable. A drug lord safe and sound in Australia doesn't care if a bunch of Malaysians get hanged, they consider losing up to 60% of their wares a cost of doing business. These characters have their "legitimate businesses" in their country of residence and don't face being extradited because countries such as Australia and Korea will not extradite people facing the death penalty.

C: Alot of countries that produce or serve as a gateway for drugs do not have the social problems themselves that are associated with drugs and don't really see a need to fight it. Especially when they reap the economic benefits.

D: Corruption of law enforcement, hmm... we could incinerate this seized cocaine, but if we sell it ourselves...

The only way to win the drug war is to make it unprofitable to those at the top, that is impossible.

Iran executes ALL drug offenders, in public, hanging them from a crane and heroin abuse is a national epidemic at every level of society.

Some might look at Singapore as an example of sucessful drug enforcement, but there are very few ways in and out of Singapore and it is a police state to begin with. There are very few places in the world where that type of enforcement would be possible and even fewer where it would be acceptable to the public at large.

[Maverick]

Interesting thread, Two things that I find myself thinking about are:

1) What if she is guilty, whether she is or isn't the case would still be portrayed in the media the same way and what would the family say anyway "Yes, she did it but she's just the nicest person..."? No of course not they would do exactly as they are doing now.

2) What if this was a 27 year old surfer dude instead of a surfer babe? My bet is this would be 3rd page news in Australia and never heard of here.

I'm not being insensitive here in fact I really feel deeply for that poor girl, the prime of her life will be taken away along with any children she may have had etc.

A very sad state of affairs, I hope she is innocent but the outcome isn't going to change.

[Super 80]

Actually drug situations involving Australians get alot of attention in the media.

There is another matter stewing in which the Australian government cooperated with the indonesians in busting some australians who now face the death penalty.

Their is an outrage that they didn't wait for them to arrive in Australia with their load before arresting them instead of giving the Indonesians a heads-up.

Some have speculated there was a back channel deal, you show the girl mercy, we give you some real criminals to throw the book at.

[Guest rattler]

Iran executes ALL drug offenders, in public, hanging them from a crane and heroin abuse is a national epidemic at every level of society.

I am not in favour of harsh punishment for the offender (user) but I am def. in favour of very harsh treatment for the offender (pusher). One is a victim the other is creating victims.

The only way MJ will be made legal in Canada will be through our political process. Maybe that is why the real reason the Liberal party is so popular east of Manitoba.

[Super 80]

Throwing a drug dealer in jail, or even executing them is not a deterrent to others… it’s a job opening.

[UpperDeck]

And at what point do you all acknowledge that you are compelled to abide by the laws of the country in which you are located?

You cannot export the expectations that arise from the country of origin.

Please understand that the Indonesian court exempts from liability any individual who is "non-complicit"; ie; was an ignorant courier. The Court did not accept the defence. Ipso facto..this woman attempted to illegally import a restricted narcotic and was caught..and paid a REDUCED penalty. Shades of a young man who was convicted in Singapore of a "graffiti offence" and sentenced to caning. Subsequent events suggest that he didn't receive enough strikes.

[Super 80]

I could buy the idea of ecstasy being smuggled from Australia and into Asia, but I have a pretty hard time believing any drug ring would bother smuggling marijuana.

That load of marijuana is worth a hell of a lot more in Australia than it is in Bali.

[Guest rattler]

Aussie smuggler jailed

By AP

An Australian woman was convicted and sentenced to 20 years in prison yesterday for smuggling 4 kg of marijuana onto Indonesia's Bali island, prompting her mother to shout "Liar!" at the judge and her country's prime minister to express sympathy.

Schapelle Corby, 27, wept as the verdict was announced. She could have faced the death penalty, but prosecutors requested a life senten

[Mitch Cronin]

Cpdude... Cigarettes and alcohol are addictive, pot isn't (nor is vanilla extract... or is it? ).

[handyman]

Cpdude... Cigarettes and alcohol are addictive, pot isn't (nor is vanilla extract... or is it? ).

Ok, ok, ok, let's say for arguments sake your right...then answer my question. Is this the final line in the sand or would you suggest a continuous easing of all drug laws?

[Guest rattler]

I always find it amazing how many folks, when they don't agree with the law ... be it the posted speed limit, smoking pot etc. ,,,,, think that it is OK to break the law. Folks that is the path to anarchy.

The ones that really bother me are those with children, quite the example to set for the young one.

Use the democratic process to have the laws changed if you don't like them, if you can not get them changed.....move to somewhere where that particular law is not in place or ............