Mitch Cronin Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Does anyone know how they're doing with the beast? I've tried hunting through google, but there's so much propaganda horseplop it's hard to sift through it all to find anything meaningful... I'm wondering how they worked out the body gear steering (or lack of same) difficulties, if indeed they did have troubles with that, and how they've dealt with their reported overweight problems? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Mitch: like you I have not seen too much "hard facts" about the 380 but here is one that might be of limited interest - seems like sep. distances might be a big concern. A380 update Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted October 15, 2005 Author Share Posted October 15, 2005 Thanks Rattler... Interesting this: The single issue preventing the aircraft’s aerodynamic configuration being frozen is the discovery that the wakes from wing spoilers can cause “very significant buffeting” of the horizontal stabiliser at certain deflections, although this is expected to prove straightforward to resolve, says Airbus vice-president flight test Fernando Alonso. It has also been determined that some reinforcement of Rib 1 in the horizontal stabiliser is required, along with very minor structural modifications in the forward fuselage, which Champion describes as “usual business” for a new aircraft programme. Hmmmm... "straightforward"... "minor structural modifications"... If I was figuring to buy one of these birds I might be a wee bit concerned by that... I did manage to find some stuff about the body gear steering... none of it from official sources, or anyone really "in the know", but I gather the beast has (at least) the rear axle of it's body gear bogies steerable... during towing tests with body gear steering disabled there was some rather alarming scrubbing going on, (evident in the photos)... but I wasn't able to find out for sure what angle they were pushing at the time... (some sites said 90 degrees, some claimed it was at the max angle of 60) With it's max steering limit of only 60 degrees, being a behemouth of that size, that could add even more limits to the number places it can be handled. All in all, so far, I think it's looking like it could turn out to be a monster dud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homerun Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 The pictures floating around of the steering test were taken of the test that was used to determine the max angle. In other words, it was pushed to failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W5 Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 http://www.airbus.com/en/presscentre/press...world_tour.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boestar Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 Actually Mitch. When I was at Bombardier with the Global Express Program, we had to make several structural changes to the original design during production to overcome shortcommings discovered during flight test. Many of the changes are transparent to the end customer. The only ill effect is that earlier serial numbers may need more frequent inspections or changes incorporated by SB in the field. B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted October 15, 2005 Author Share Posted October 15, 2005 Puh!... I still think it's a dud. Time will tell I guess. I don't look forward to hearing about ... the ... unspeakable.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W5 Posted November 4, 2005 Share Posted November 4, 2005 Third A380 flies as demo tour is postponed http://www.flightinternational.com/Article...+postponed.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IFG Posted November 6, 2005 Share Posted November 6, 2005 Puh!... I still think it's a dud. Time will tell I guess. I don't look forward to hearing about ... the ... unspeakable.... You've made that observation respecting the A-380 before, Mitch ... any premonitions? It's to be expected that certification flight testing will expose a few discrepencies. If the design emerged perfectly formed from the CADCAM screens, there wouldn't be any need to spend a couple of billion bucks (or euros) thrashing it around, would there? Most of us folks that fly'em and fix'em know of several problems and mod's during certification on the aircraft we now fly, including the love of your life (the aluminium one, that is ), which had a cargo door glitch, mishandling of which hopefully taught the industry and the regulators a thing or two ... why not give this one a chance (ugly as it is ). Cheers, IFG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted November 6, 2005 Author Share Posted November 6, 2005 Fair comments IFG... I guess I have a few problems with this one... First off, it just makes me feel uneasy and I can't quite trap the feeling for analysis... I'm not sure if it's just the size, the ugliness, the number of people it can carry, or if it's some kind of premonition that I can't identify as such, but I think I've only had this feeling about an airplane twice before. ...and though I've heard through the grapevine the second one did meet an ugly demise in Africa somewhere (one of the South African A300's WD flew for a while), I've never done any research to verify that. - The first time was really with every Nationair airplane I saw, but one in particular gave me the creeps big time... Likewise, I have no idea if that turned out to be the one that burned in Jedah or not... Also, I may be a bit of a granny, but when I think of the enormous pressure to make this giant work, that the whole Airbus family of companies (used to be called Aeroformation - don't know if they still use that name?) must be under.... I'm thinking at this point they'll produce it. ...Regardless of any "ya but" 's some backroom engineer might happen to blurt out (if he even has the courage). The A380 will get a chance, but man thats an awful lot of people to make any mistakes with! I have confidence in the Airbus design methods in general, but they do make mistakes. And then there's my own estimation of it's value.... I have a hunch that in the end it will turn out to be something of a dud. Given it's particularly unique needs in terms of facilities for all things on the ground, the few airports that can accommodate it, the few airlines that will find having it worthwhile, and the huge cost of creating it.... I can picture a few of them being turned into restaurants, or hotels maybe? ...then again, I'll bet a few folks thought the 747 was going to be a dud too. Maybe I just feel a bit like I've always imagined Orville and Wilbur would have felt if you could have showed them a 747 in 1903, and told them it could fly? Cheers, Mitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomerPete Posted November 6, 2005 Share Posted November 6, 2005 Mitch ... Here's a production list of Wardair's A300's. It looks like all of them are still flying. There was of course the ex-Wardair A310 that Thai ran into a mountain in Kathmandu but I don't think that was what you were thinking of, was it? Pete PS "Aeroformation" was (is?) the name of the Airbus training division, not the company as a whole. Wardair A300 Production List Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted November 7, 2005 Author Share Posted November 7, 2005 Yikes! Sometimes, after I wake up and read what I wrote before I went to sleep I'm amazed any of you guys ever bother to talk with me... But I try to stay real, so it's at least genuine as to how I felt at the time..... for whatever that's worth? Anyway, Thanks Pete. That's good to hear. I remember the day I felt that "creeped out" on one of those birds (some of us called them I Z Junk, I Z Lousy, and I Z No good)... I can't remember which one of them it was, but I had to get off the airplane... was onboard for the first time, just snooping... and the hair on the back of my neck started dancing, ...I felt like I was seeing ghosts. I never did like those airplanes. I'm glad to hear they're all still whole. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AME Posted November 7, 2005 Share Posted November 7, 2005 I felt like I was seeing ghosts. It has happened before http://www.geocities.com/donuts13/main_9.htm http://www.near-death.com/ghosts.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airband Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 World's Largest Jet Completes Asia Test Thursday November 10, 2005. SINGAPORE (AP) — The Airbus A380, the world's largest passenger jet, completed its first flight outside of Europe on Friday, landing at Singapore's Changi Airport to begin a regional tour aimed at wooing new customers a year before the first commercial delivery. The double-decker superjumbo taxied onto the tarmac amid hundreds of onlookers and tight security after a 13 hour, 8,389-mile flight from Airbus' headquarters in Toulouse, southwest France. It is the plane's first long-haul test run outside Europe. The A380 prototype was originally due to arrive Tuesday in Singapore — the first stop of an Asian tour that includes Australia and Malaysia — but Airbus postponed the trip to replace two of the plane's four engines. Airbus SAS is already running behind schedule in the A380 delivery for some Asian airlines, so the additional delay is an embarrassment for the European jet maker as it tries to entice additional customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockyc Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 Does anyone know what the current break-even sales point is ? The point at which Airbus begins to make a profit on the behemoth? Last I recollect it was something around 250 and sales were somewhat behind. Is there a lot of smoke and mirrors around this type of figure? i.e. is it sales at full price (who pays that?) or is it an average price of some kind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted November 11, 2005 Share Posted November 11, 2005 And it came to pass..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Interesting that two of the engines needed replacement already. Thousands cheer as Airbus A380 superjumbo touches down in Australia Canadian Press Saturday, November 12, 2005 SYDNEY, Australia (AP) - The world's largest passenger jet flew low over Sydney Harbour Sunday on the second leg of its three-city tour of Australia. The Airbus A380 flew over the harbour and its famous bridge and opera house before touching down at Sydney Airport. The giant plane was decked out in Qantas markings along its side but still carried the Airbus logo on its tail. Qantas has ordered 12 of the planes, which have a list price of $292 million US, and expects to take delivery of its first one in April 2007. A day earlier, thousands of spectators turned out to watch the A380 touched down in Australia for the first time at Brisbane Airport after an overnight flight from Singapore, where it arrived Friday on the first leg of an Asian tour to woo new customers. It drew huge crowds in Brisbane, said airport spokesman Jim Carden. "It was a wonderful occasion," he said. "There's a fantastic crowd. It must be tens of thousands. Aviation enthusiasts but also mums, dads and kids." The white jet, as tall as a seven-storey building and stretching about three-quarters of the length of a soccer field, is designed to carry 555 passengers but can be stretched to accommodate 800, Airbus says. By 2006, 20 airports will be ready for the A380 including Singapore, Melbourne, Kuala Lumpur, Sydney, Paris, Dubai and New York. By 2008, 38 airports will be ready and 60 by 2010, Airbus said in a statement. Six other carriers in the region have ordered A380s. The 49 Asian and Australian orders make up 31 per cent of 159 firm orders for the superjumbos. The A380 prototype was originally due to arrive Tuesday in Singapore but Airbus postponed the trip to replace two of the plane's four engines. Airbus is already running behind schedule in the A380 delivery for some Asian airlines, so the additional delay was an embarrassment for the European jet maker as it tries to entice more buyers. The plane that arrived in Sydney was to fly to the southern city of Melbourne on Monday before returning to Brisbane to be the centre point of 85th birthday celebrations for Qantas. It was to depart for Asia on Wednesday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handyman Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 By 2006, 20 airports will be ready for the A380 including Singapore, Melbourne, Kuala Lumpur, Sydney, Paris, Dubai and New York. By 2008, 38 airports will be ready and 60 by 2010, Airbus said in a statement. That's great! So what about alternates? How many airports are willing to be shut down or severely limited by the unscheduled landing of this beast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airband Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 The Airbus A380 flew over the harbour and its famous bridge and opera house before touching down at Sydney Airport. Aw hell, if it was a real airplane, they woulda gone under the bridge.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Interesting that two of the engines needed replacement already. I think you will find that removing and stripping the new engines is a normal part of the flight test and certification program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 I think you will find that removing and stripping the new engines is a normal part of the flight test and certification program. Evidently not quite. Airbus A380 tour update 4 November 2005 At the request of Rolls-Royce, as a precautionary measure, two Trent 900 engines are being replaced on A380 number One. This follows a thorough review by the engine manufacturer of an earlier engine change, and leads to a slight shift in the A380 tour to Asia and Australia. The A380 is now due to arrive in Singapore on Friday 11th November, instead of Tuesday 8th. The subsequent tour to Australia remains unchanged. The aircraft will then visit Kuala Lumpur on Thursday 17th November. The first A380 made its first flight on 27th April and the second on 18th October. In total, both aircraft have satisfactorily performed some 440 flight hours in over 120 flights. The third A380, MSN 2, had a successful maiden flight yesterday, 3rd November and joins the flight test programme. Flight tests of the A380 are progressing without any major issues being discovered. Certification is planned for the last quarter of 2006 in time for first delivery to the first operator Singapore Airlines before the end of the year. Airbus is an EADS joint company with BAE Systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 13, 2005 Share Posted November 13, 2005 Evidently not quite. I seem to recall a couple of planned engine changes in the flight test program schedule that someone posted here a while back. Regardless if something unusual showed up it would be prudent to take a look. AWST highlighted one such problem with overheating in the engine pylons several issues back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 I seem to recall a couple of planned engine changes in the flight test program schedule that someone posted here a while back. Regardless if something unusual showed up it would be prudent to take a look. AWST highlighted one such problem with overheating in the engine pylons several issues back. Def. the time to find out and solve any problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W5 Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 A380 unveiled in Emirates colours http://www.flightinternational.com/Article...es+colours.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted November 22, 2005 Share Posted November 22, 2005 A380 superjumbo turbulence may cause delays in airports: Airbus CEO 11-22-2005, 19h13 DUBAI (AFP) Concerns about turbulence behind Airbus' new A380 superjumbo might mean longer waits between take-off times when the airliner takes to the skies next year, the company's chief executive said. Responding to a report in the Wall Street Journal Europe that industry regulators are concerned about the wake created by the A380, Gustav Humbert said that longer separation times between aircraft might initially be introduced "as a precautionary measure" before being reduced. "It's possible that they (regulators) say 'let's have entry to service of the A380 with longer separation times' as a precautionary measure and then reduce them," the European aircraft maker's chief executive told journalists on the sidelines of the Dubai air show. The report in the WSJE, quoting preliminary safety guidelines from the International Civil Aviation Organization, said that airliners may have to fly at least twice the normal distance behind the A380 to avoid possible danger from vortex turbulence in its wake. The overall effect of a rule delaying the arrival of following aircraft would be to increase congestion at hub airports and reduce a cost-advantage selling point of the A380, which is to increase efficiency at congested mainline airports, the newspaper said. Gumbert said that longer separation distances had also been introduced when the 747 jumbo was launched by Boeing in 1970. "Even if at the beginning they do it like for the 747, we should not be surprised," he said. The report in the WSJE said that the standards put out by the aviation organzation this month were provisional and probably more cautious than formal rules expected next year. The Airbus A380 can carry up to about 850 passengers and is due to go into service next year. The ICAO report said that the "significantly stronger" turbulence left by the superjumbo, compared to the draft left by smaller airliners, indicated that the minimum distance left by following aircraft when landing should be 10 nautical miles instead of five, and that the distance in the air should be 15 miles. The report quoted a spokesman for the German airline Lufthansa as saying that the airline operated at congested airports and that "it is crucial for us that the separation is the same as for a (Boeing) 747". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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