conehead Posted December 27, 2016 Share Posted December 27, 2016 This article leads one to believe so... Korean Air crew to 'use more force' with unruly passengershttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38441521 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 If I could figure out how to override the defib controls, it would make on heck of a "taser". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innuendo Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 I wonder how cabin crews being responsible for Tazer type of weapons will fit with the restrictions on that sort of device in the countries they operate into. In Canada f'rinstance, (from a CBC article): Quote: In Canada, however, Tasers are a prohibited weapon. Only one company can import them into Canada under a special permit, and they can only sell the devices to law enforcement agencies, said RCMP Cpl. Greg Gillis, who trains police officers in how to use Tasers. Each Taser sale is registered and tracked, much like a handgun, he said. Quote. I imagine a lot of countries will have some sort of level of control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conehead Posted December 28, 2016 Author Share Posted December 28, 2016 8 hours ago, moeman said: If I could figure out how to override the defib controls, it would make on heck of a "taser". Now, that's funny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 9 hours ago, moeman said: If I could figure out how to override the defib controls, it would make on heck of a "taser". Yes but convincing the badguy to remove his shirt and stand still while you apply the contact patches might not be that easy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted December 29, 2016 Share Posted December 29, 2016 On 12/28/2016 at 6:27 AM, seeker said: Yes but convincing the badguy to remove his shirt and stand still while you apply the contact patches might not be that easy! Shaving his chest first might be the deal breaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted December 29, 2016 Share Posted December 29, 2016 Do air carriers have blanket approval to carry and their employees the lawful authority to use 'prohibited weapons in this Country nowadays? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 1 hour ago, DEFCON said: Do air carriers have blanket approval to carry and their employees the lawful authority to use 'prohibited weapons in this Country nowadays? "Stun Guns in Canada, evidently do not fall within that category. A prohibited firearm is: a handgun with a barrel length of 105 mm (4.1 inches) or less; a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 25 or 32 calibre ammunition; a rifle or shotgun that has been altered to make it less than 660 mm (26 inches) in overall length; a rifle or shotgun that has been altered to make the barrel length less than 457 mm (18 inches) where the overall firearm length is 660 mm (26 inches) or more; an automatic firearm and a converted automatic firearm; any firearm prescribed as prohibited. Prohibited weapons, ammunition and devices include: Silencers. Switchblade knives. Large-capacity cartridge magazines. Weapons, parts, components or ammunition declared prohibited by Order in Council, such as: Body-armour piercing handgun cartridges, incendiary and explosive projectiles and shotgun "flechette" cartridges. "Bull-pup" stocks for rifles or carbines. Stun guns. SS-1 Stingers and variants. Brass knuckles. Mace, tear gas. Certain martial arts devices http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/form-formulaire/pdfs/5488-eng.pdf but according to another source they are: http://legalbeagle.com/6647457-personal-stun-gun-laws-canada.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innuendo Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 I have to think that the implementation of crew training, regulatory compliance and security of the devices, both enroute and on the ground, in the countries you operate in, would be a bureaucratic nightmare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 Thanks Malcolm, that's interesting information. The 'Carrier Application' is an official document' that places stun guns in the 'prohibited' category. The 'Legal Beagle' circular is a product of the internet and confuses the issue in a few ways including its 'restricted' categorization of the weapon. The law considers the Captain to be a peace officer, so maybe, but I can't see any circumstance that would move our government to allow other crew members to start zapping passengers anywhere within our borders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 30, 2016 Share Posted December 30, 2016 Innuendo: Kin to American Pilots being allowed to carry handguns in the cockpit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ywgame Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Tasers are specifically mentioned as prohibited in the criminal code...as are "stun guns" under a certain length..." Former Prohibited Weapons Order, No. 3 6 Any device that is designed to be capable of injuring, immobilizing or incapacitating a person or an animal by discharging an electrical charge produced by means of the amplification or accumulation of the electrical current generated by a battery, where the device is designed or altered so that the electrical charge may be discharged when the device is of a length of less than 480 mm, and any similar device. However that leaves anything over 480mm as ok...wiggle room for cattle prods. There is no mention of maximum voltage, joules or such. There are "stun batons" marketed in Canada without restriction. However, even those things that there is no regulation against can still be classified as a weapon (ie baseball bat) depending on how it is used and the legal implications become very tangled. Doesn't Korean still have armed air marshals on every flight...they used to, maybe they're saving some cash and arming flight attendants with "less lethal". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Here is an update re their use of tasers. Korean Air used electric stun gun on five passengers By Simon Atkinson Asia Business Reporter, BBC News, Singapore 19 January 2017 From the section http://www.bbc.com/news/business-38580804 Image copyright EPA South Korea's national airline has used electric stun guns on five passengers during flights, the BBC has learned. Korean Air is believed to be the only major carrier to routinely have the weapons on board. The airline is ramping up training for staff using the guns after criticism for the way it handled a recent in-flight disturbance. In that incident, US singer Richard Marx was among passengers who helped restrain an unruly passenger. Afterwards, both Mr Marx and his wife Daisy Fuentes used social media to claim that the crew was "ill-trained". Ms Fuentes wrote on Instagram: "They didn't know how to use the Taser and didn't know how to secure the rope" around the passenger. Taser is a brand name of a electric stun gun. The reference surprised many who did not expect airlines to carry the weapons, which are more commonly used by police. Paralysis The carrier told the BBC it first introduced electric stun guns in 2002. It now carries at least one set of weapons on every plane, with two sets on its A380 jumbo jets. A Korean Air spokesman said that of the five incidents, three involved the gun being fired. In those instances, the gun used compressed air to fire darts that release a 50,000-volt electric charge, designed to temporarily paralyse the target. In the two other cases, the weapon was used as a stun gun, with the electric current fired directly into the passenger, with the weapon held against them at close range. Korean Air would not give further details about what prompted each incident, when they occurred or what happened to the passengers. But it confirmed all took place while the aircraft were airborne. Image copyright Instagram / @daisyfuentes Image caption Daisy Fuentes posted about the incident on her Instagram account After the incident involving Mr Marx, the airline said it was training its crews to use the weapons more "readily" against violent passengers. 'Asian culture' It also invited media to see a session where crew were practising using Tasers. Korean Air's former president, Chi Chang-hoon, said Asian airlines had not followed US carriers in tackling on-board violence and suggested "Asian culture" was to blame. However, the airline's spokesman said that current protocol limited cabin crews to using tasers "only during life threatening situation or when the safety of an aircraft is threatened". Do other airlines carry electric stun guns? The International Air Transport Association (IATA) said airlines were not required to inform them if they carried the weapons on board. Several major carriers contacted by the BBC declined to comment on whether or not they had Tasers on board, citing security concerns. But some large airlines including Etihad, Malaysia Airlines and India's Jet Airways confirmed they did not carry electric stun guns. And sources at other global carriers, including Emirates and Lufthansa, also said they were not part of standard on-board kit, although the airlines did not officially confirm this. However, most airlines do carry equipment to restrain disruptive passengers including ropes, cuffs and adhesive tape. Are Tasers safe to use on planes? There is some risk to using Tasers or other similar stun guns, although this tends to revolve around the harm to those hit by them. In the UK, there have been at least 17 deaths linked to the use of stun guns since they were introduced by police in 2003. And while not ideal to use one on a plane, there is not thought to be any great risk to the safety of a plane if a Taser was activated. Bear in mind that proponents of air marshals (see below) argue that even when using regular gunfire on a flight - the level of risk is manageable. Image copyright EPA How common are disruptive passengers? Unruly behaviour on aircraft is a growing problem according to a study by IATA, with a sharp rise of incidents in 2015. Incidents of people getting in fights, being verbally abusive or refusing to follow cabin crew orders were up by 17%. Alcohol or drug use was identified as a factor in one-in-four incidents. In 11% of cases, there was physical aggression or even damage to the aircraft. Some 10,854 incidents of passengers disrupting flights were reported to IATA last year, up from 9,316 incidents in 2014. That's one incident for every 1,205 flights. Are there still air marshals on planes? An air marshal is an undercover armed guard on board a commercial aircraft, to counter hijackings and other hostile acts. In the event of an imminent threat from a passenger, air marshals say they are trained to respond with lethal force. Their use was ramped up, especially in the US, after the 11 September 2001 attacks. It is thought there are now several thousand marshals employed by the US Department for Homeland Security, compared with the 33 flying regularly pre-9/11. Israel's El Al has had armed marshals operating on its flights for more than 30 years. IATA says that - perhaps not surprisingly - countries which do employ air marshals, do not disclose which flights they are on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conehead Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 Ah-ha! I thought there was something to this story! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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