Mitch Cronin Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 I've just wrangled a week off (not much wrangling really... I just used my last vacation bid for an I-need-a-break! right now style)... and as it happens, my daughter has just finished exams and isn't due back at school 'til next Thursday... thinkin' of maybe the two of us hopping on a flying machine for a visit with family on Sunny Salt Spring Island... dunno just yet, but I'd like to explore the notion some... Anyone have any ideas what kind of loads I'd be dealing with between YYZ and YVR?... leaving Sunday or Monday... coming back Wednesday? ...or can someone remind me how to look for myself?... if that's still possible in these post-Mark-Hill days? (I haven't flown anywhere in a few years!) ...Next question: Do you fellers who holds the trottles in yer hands still like ta chop 'em back to a climb setting after take-off so quick that it leaves some of us silly sods in the back feelin' like we've just stopped and are about to fall out of the sky? - like Wile E. Coyote after he's just run off a cliff - Kripes I hate that! Muchos Gracias... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Mitch Go to the employee travel site and check-in. AC Travel for Employees You can check all the loads there . Start by clicking up on the top after you are in, on FLIGHTS and then FLIGHTS (SA) Climb power....these new fangled auto throttle planes will never be as smooth as the T-Rex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.O. Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Climb power....these new fangled auto throttle planes will never be as smooth as the T-Rex Horse hockey! I can be just as smooth in the Nintendo Cruiser as any SLUF pilot. Another thing, it always drove me nuts on the Trex on those occasions when we did reduced thrust takeoffs, after which when you called for climb power, the thrust levers went forward! What's up with that?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Hudson Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Mitch; re Do you fellers who holds the trottles in yer hands still like ta chop 'em back to a climb setting after take-off so quick Its airmanship Mitch...the CFM56 engine is SO responsive to thrust lever movement (variable stator vane system) that it takes a bit of care to handle the thrust reduction. The Airbus thrust levers are "set" in position much like the telegraphs on ships were and don't move (they're really "request" or "regime" or even "authority" levers and respond to many other auto-throttle/autopilot/FMC commands within the limits set by the thrust-lever position) and are set in detents rather than moving smoothly from full to idle, etc. The engines respond immediately to the change in position, and snapping them back into the "CLIMB" detent is not needed. It can be done slowly to the point where the passengers don't notice. Being thrown forward is not what they're paying for. In the end, its not an operational issue but finesse and lack of it that you're experiencing. Kip: re Climb power....these new fangled auto throttle planes will never be as smooth as the T-Rex Irrelevant to the discussion Kip, but that doesn't mean the T-Rex and its Douglas cousin the DC9 (and the 8, and the rest of the Boeings) weren't mighty fine airplanes to fly! They also rewarded 'handling with care' and told you (especially the '8) when you didn't flare just right! They had their time and their limitations. We've both likely done CATII's in T-Rex's and DCNeufs but I'll take the Airbus on a CATIII any day over anything except perhaps the L1011...brilliant aircraft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 Thank you Kip. I'll have a look.... ...Yeah, no doubt some of these gents would have me believe that hangin'-in-space feeling is the airplane's fault... but I can still hope they could prevent it if they tried. I know I'm not the only ding-dong who get's a little antsy when he feels that and can't see airspeed indication. You should've seen my mum whenever that happened! ...second thought... no... not a pretty sight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 Thanks Don (previous response written before reading your's). I thought so. It may well be something many pilots are not in tune with... After several gazzillion ups and downs... and with all the plain indications that all is exactly as it should be right in front of your noses... it might just take a comment or two from those who experience it differently to bring it to mind. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 DON Irrelevant to the discussion Kip, Not so..... A good T-Rex pilot could move the thrust levers with the finesse of a skilled surgeon and you just admitted that perhaps some of the boys are not that adept with the "auto-throttle in a bottle" machines. You might have also noted the smilie that indicated I was poking fun at the new flying videotrons. I have no problems with the advancement of technology but there are times when human intervention is required to polish the end result. In the A310, we used to start the descent manually just before the "bent arrow" otherwise the technology pulled back the power and over we went. The same thing happened on level-off in a climb. As a "dot" I have done a number of trips in the A320/319 and on ocassion it is very obvious that the guys up front are letting the technology do it all and probably most pax/guests could care less but you know as well as I do when a pilot sits in the rear he is probably tuned to all these nuances, nuances that indicate to me that there is a real smooth driver....or perhaps not..... in the pointy end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rattler Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Mitch, don't know if you are already set up for the trip but Rumrabbit (interline discounts) is showing a cottage rental on Saltspring. Rumrabbit Also the BC Ferry sked page may be of interest..... avoids a long swim .... BC Ferries Also you might want to consider going directly to YYJ rather than YVR. You avoid the YVR AIF and the ferries for Saltspring leave from both Swartzbay & Tsawwassen . However, if you plan to rent a car the rates at YVR are normally 100.00 cheaper for a week than those at YYJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 Rumrabbit eh? Almost sounds right up my alley doesn't it? Naw... no cottages needed. I have two brothers living there... and oodles of space to stay. Thanks though.. Also, likely would hop on a Beaver at the Flying Beaver... when returning that also allows avoidance of the YVR AIF since travel originated elsewhere. Unfortunately, the employee travel site want's a PIN to get in... No idea what mine might be... I remember being told I had been mailed one, but I don't remember ever seeing it. ....[later]... darlin' wife finds PIN (Magic!)... but son is so upset with notion of being left behind... and other brother in Victoria would be ticked that -yet again - I'd be skipping out on any stay with him... I'd better not go... Thanks though gents... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicoChico Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Hi Mitch, Now you have hit upon my pet peeve (or as George Carlin likes to say I don't have pet peeves - I have major freakin' psychotic hangups!) I used to do line-indoc on the A320/319/321. It was a great opportunity to set someone straight on the fact that the AutoThrottles will reduce thrust corresponding to the rate you pull back the thrust levers. Yanking them back simulates a dual engine failure to the "guests" quite nicely thank you very much! Whenever I flew with someone who babied the throttles back into climb thrust I would always (and I mean always) compliment them on their airmanship. I like to say you can tell a lot about an A320 pilot by how he sets climb thrust. As for the steam vs magic debate. I flew with smoothies and ham-fists on both types. It always blew me away on the DC-9 when guys slammed the throttles closed for descent. All things being equal give ME a bus in low-vis anytime! Cheers Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest directlaw Posted January 27, 2006 Share Posted January 27, 2006 Mitch, I move em smooooooooth. I think part of the problem is that in the past we, me anyway, were taught to use the thrust levers as switches. This detent to this detent to the next. Not very smooth. There are still those out there who do it. So be prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted January 27, 2006 Author Share Posted January 27, 2006 Cool... sounds like a fair number of you are very aware of the discomfort that can be created - or avoided - in that particular phase of flight. Hopefully that means the next time I'm trying to anticipate it, - so as to avoid the ultra-accelerated heart rate that often accompanies any just-run-off-a-cliff sorts of feelings - ... I'll hardly feel it at all. Not really a big deal I suppose... but for many (as I hinted, my mother was one who'd crawl right out of her skin at the slightest sudden change in acceleration, in any direction!)... I'm sure the effort to be smooooth is appreciated. Me? I'm just not much good being anyone's passenger, unless they're the best there is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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