Maverick Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Just reading a thread down below and I was struck by a couple of statements made: 1. CAT3DUAL, you said "Their worst fears is a leaner more cost effective AC" (you were talking about WJ) nothing my friend could be further from the truth, a lean and cost effective AC would not be lashing out at WJ, CJ or those other quebec based companies with ridiculous fare wars. It would have respectable profits and returns for shareholders and employees and the kinds of actions it is doing wouldn't be nessecary. 2. There has been a few of the "enjoy the KD", "we'll kick your a$$ when we restructure", "You'll get yours" directed at the WJ boys (me included) and while I won't speak for the others, I will say this this, when I read this I go to work with a renewed sense of purpose as I reach under seats and into seat pockets to take out garbage on turns, wipe down the cowls etc. Basically when people wish me and my co-workers harm I get mad, I wish a better fate for AC than you wish us, I really do. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 On the behalf of all of us at AC who just want to provide a quality product and earn a living while doing so, I apologize for the malice expressed by our brethren. It is too bad... And odd, it seems to me... If that kind of "scorched earth" strategy had ever been correct how the hell would we have ended up where we are now? Oh ya, I forgot... It's all of us rotten employees that caused this trouble by earning too much.... right... ...sigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JakeYYZ Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 CAT3DUAL.... I've nicknamed him "The Unityper" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CJ Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Please be assured Maverick not everyone at AC wishes Westjet harm or malice. Personally I think Westjet is a great option for the travelling public. Healthy competition is good for everyone. A page out of their customer service book would do some AC employees alot of good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 11, 2003 Author Share Posted May 11, 2003 The problem IMHO is not wages and never has been, it's costs, how much does it cost to send 1 bum 1 mile? The killer for AC as I see it beyond the ruinous fare wars are the fixed costs, the $20 cleaner or rampy and with all due respect to these people I don't think these were ever intended to be anything more than entry level positions, a stepping stone to a more permanent and gratifying career. But even with that it's must be extraordinarily difficult to schedule these guys for efficiency. A side note to this is they have always been the more militant side of the IAM be that they are better organised than the mechs, I don't know. The same could probably be said for flight attendants, I know there are exceptions but how long can most people reasonably keep a genuine smile and joy for a job like that? I guess I kinda lost my original point of this thread but oh well. (d) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 11, 2003 Author Share Posted May 11, 2003 I realise that as well, I know there are some guys that are giddy at the thought of AC going under, I am not. I know way too many people who will be devastated in the literal sense if that occurs. Ideally I would like to be bitching at all you AC guys in twenty years on this forum. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airmail Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Maverick: I think most if not all AC employees would just like to put in an honest day's work for an honest day's pay and help out our customers in the process. It's when we hear cocky WJ types make comments about how we have no hope of restructuring or that bonehead WJ employee who came to the AC employee parking lot in YUL 10 days or so ago with a WJ flag that motivates many of us to ensure that we come out of CCAA leaner and more competitive than you've ever seen us. It's also when your CEO makes disparaging remarks about AC that adds fuel to the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagger Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 First you say wages are not the issue, then you talk about overpaid employees. Obviously, group of AC employees has different wage and productivity issues. But there is clearly a correlations between overall costs and labor costs. It may be that the issue in one bargaining unit is productivity - too many employees for the work - while in another, it's pay. In some units, the productivity gap may be small, in others large. That's why long-term solutions are not likely to be uniform, company-wide, just as the settlements at large US carriers varied from unit to unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nozel Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 A side note to this is they have always been the more militant side of the IAM be that they are better organised than the mechs, I don't know. Cleaners are not better organised than the mechs;they out number us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 "that bonehead WJ employee who came to the AC employee parking lot in YUL 10 days or so ago with a WJ flag" If it smells like a dog.... sounds like a dog... looks like a dog... and acts like a dog.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Clumsy Lover Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Hi Maverick.. Believe me, not all of us at AC have that attitude. I also appoloagize on behalf of the knucklehead. I think that your other comments about AC are very true. In my opinion AC has to stop being all things to all people and get back to what we should be doing. Moving people on flights over 1.5 hours in length between major cities, trans-con and Interntaional flights. We should not be trying to be travel agents , groomers , the bag loaders , the regional airline , the publishers , etc. We need to maintain our fleet, fly it and provide some real customer service. I don't know where things went so astray, it was long before my time at the airline, but it still peeves me off when your in T2 and the line up is crazy for the pax and you look around and see loads of people moving paper, people sitting around the coffee shop with their uniform sleeves ripped off and the customer service agaents swamped with &%$@! off passengers. Something is wrong with this airline. I just hope that after I get called back from my layoff there will be a stable airline left. Cheers The clumsy lover P.S. Sorry for the spelling and grammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Right - flippin - on! Damn good post! That gents, is the meat of the matter! imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 11, 2003 Author Share Posted May 11, 2003 Agreed, I kind of went in circles but my point is that the rampies in particular add a huge cost to an operation as they must staff for peak times. We use contractors and only pay when they are used and besides we can yell at them when they aren't doing their job. Would they be competitive with Globeground or Worldwide if they had their wages? Who is to know but that is an obvious place to start thinks me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 11, 2003 Share Posted May 11, 2003 Airmail, Like yourself, I too get a little upset when I hear comments from the WJ folks who are hoping for nothing less that the complete demise of AC. It is not a widely hope for scenario by the majority at WJ I am sure, but it is always the militant or moronic ones that seem to be heard. WJ is a fine airline and I hope they prosper for many years to come, but I am afraid that Mr. Beddoe's bubble will burst by years end. If first quater results are any indication of the future, an aproximate 7 million drop in profit for one quarter would have me worried sick.West jet is expanding and buying more and new equipement, well they will now have to start paying for that equipement.I would not be the least surprised in WJ string or quarterly profits comes to an end this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp fa Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Maverick, unfortunately there are a number of posters from AC, Westjet, or whatever, that want to see the competition go under, and all of those employees out of work, so that their own careers will prosper. For some of them, that is about the extent of their career aspirations. How sad, and for lack of a better word, what a bunch of &%$@!s. For the rest of us, all we want is to be able to provide for our families, and hope the same for those of you working in other areas of the industry. Cheers, and all the best, on my last Mother's Day before I turn into an empty nester. :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp fa Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Well, apparently "&%$@!s" won't make it past the censor. You learn something new every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjaer Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 you will see at the end of next quarter... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Hi Robert, good to get a few more AME's opinions in here. I believe you will be shown to be incorrect on the string of profits at least for this year. We put a lot of capacity on in the 4th and 1st quarters (A mistake? perhaps or perhaps not) and the market for the first time couldn't swallow it all. Be it Sept 11 or enduring Iraqi freedom storm part deux or High oil, SARS, GTAA etc. we were still profitable although only marginally so. If the situation worsens somehow then yes we will probably report a loss but we aren't dinosaurs we are constantly adapting. (I hope)Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dash eight Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Yes that is right maverick obviously you are a pilot and we all know pilots cannot do anything wrong..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 second and third quarters are always the strongest quarters, it will be the fourth tht will be dicy, but I hope you prove me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 Maverick, I truly hope I am wrong! On a side note, we here at AC have been debating for a while about WJ AME pay, what does a topped out line AME make, base pay. At AC what we call an LAT4 makes 32.87/hr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjaer Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 And I hope that AC comes out strong in the future too. The only people who win would be the public if we had a healthy AC and WJA competing for their dollar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2003 Share Posted May 12, 2003 you are of course correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Hi Robert, Top rate for an endorsed AME is $29.42/hr, 40 hour work week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Posted May 12, 2003 Author Share Posted May 12, 2003 Actually I am an AME, so I do get to watch the goings on of the ramp operation. Besides I don't have the background to be a pilot. (My parents are married) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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