rudder Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 Rumour that AC does not have enough qualified RJ pilots to operate AC RJ fleet and therefore several AC RJ's are 'parked' due to lack of staff - fact or fiction? AC CMSC Bid 03-01 showed 317 AC pilots as surplus and initial layoffs were to commence August 2003. Progressive layoffs would continue until October 2004 when the last of the 317 would be placed on layoff. Less than 100 have been laid off thus far and planned layoffs for 2004 have been 'suspended' - fact or fiction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S. Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 You say that AC mainline has laid off less than 100 pilots? If this is true then perhaps another rumour is also true. Have you heard this one: A large number of pilots who were positioned on the RJ have been booking off before or during their ground school. This accomplishes 2 things..They can't get trained, and they haven't done Line indoc so their pay isn't reduced to RJ rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest acj Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 Also heard that the AMP is not in effect at AC mainline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labtec Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 Not true. What has happened is that a large number of pilots that were on the 320 and now forced to the CL65 have elected to take leaves of absence. Most are now in the Mid-east a few are in Asia or europe and a bunch went back into the military. The prospect of going from a 90k/year job to a 40k/year job earning less than the F/A's has caused alot of guys to look at the quality of AC as an employer. My suspicion is that most will not return if called back. Giguere and the boys are turning the place into a second rate airline from a pilots perspective. Under no circumstances should a pilot earn less than a flight attendant and that is what Air Canada has done. It would be interesting to hear the thoughts of passengers if they knew that their pilot was earning less than the person serving them their crummy food. Anyone who has booked off before a CL65 groundschool generally is a party to a conference call with the director of training, CP and the Flight Manager. There was one such incident and that individual is now out on disability. He crushed some vertebre. I doubt one would go to that length to avoid a CL65 course, it may even mean he cannot fly again. AC has laid off, on average 30 pilots per month since the furloughs began August 1. I believe we are up to 120. 200 should be gone by December. Most were on flat pay so we aren't saving much. We are very short F/O's on the 320 and CL65 however, and the draft premium is being paid out often. From what I hear at Jazz the same overtime game is being played there as well. Labtec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HPT-TOUR Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 Gimme a break Labtec, why are you blamming Geguere, didn`t acpa give up millions of dollars in wages for scope. Don`t tell me he held a gun to your head to sign your contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kilo Mike Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 HPT didn`t acpa give up millions of dollars in wages for scope. No more than what Nickie D gave up to try and take flying away from the mainline. Have to love those new wages you are flying around with eh? Don`t tell me he held a gun to your head to sign your contract. Now this one made me laugh. Is your memory so short that you forgot what was going on at the end of June this year... hint... threat of shutting down the company. Now I realize that Jazz never even had the chance to vote on their contract..It was ordained from the MEC that it shall be so.. aren't you guys lucky. The rest of us voted with a gun to our head Still chuckling KM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Labtec Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 If you are a pilot for Jazz keep up the fair work. The company and the business people that tell you what to do on a daily basis absolutely love your rage against your fellow aviators. The lawyers are making a killing off of ALPA and ACPA and will continue to do so. It is clear from the state of this industry, in Canada, that one need not be intelligent to drive a plane. You are the very reason pilots, in Canada, will never be more than a bunch of bus drivers. Labtec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HPT-TOUR Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 You voted with a gun to your head! RIGHT......., why don`t you start another petition KM...... you know like your sucessful no C2 for Jazz employees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HPT-TOUR Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 Labtec, let me let you in on a little secret, we are not paying for our lawyers, but if things don`t go your way you sure will. As for your need to compare the state of the industry to intelligence well if think the above first sentence covers that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kilo Mike Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 Wow HPT. You hit all three of your predictable themes tonight: A Man you guys from ACPA have scr*wed the regionals. B Nanny Nanny poo poo .. I'm a C2. And my personal favorite C Oh yeah..we'll get you in court. Honest. It's going really really well. Have I missed any? Care to have a burst of creativity and come up with something different that might actually be thought provoking and on thread topic? Come on HPT... you can do it. Put the doll down for a sec and think really really hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest western Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 Hey Kilo Mike, you should take your mirror and go lay down; someone let me know when the narcissistic asswipe has gone to bed; in fact that may be the problem, the 3rd wife has it...IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest abc Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 Nickie D. Nice! KM shame, shame. A lot of pilots took a pay cut at Jazz to try to save the company which they have worked for, for many, many years. But it was a pay cut everywhere. All FOs, all Captains, all crew schedulers, all dispatchers, all AMEs, all FAs. Many at Jazz are trying to breathe life support into Air Canada. Hopefully Jazz can save Air Canada and we can all resume our jobs, secure in the knowledge that our next paycheck is forthcoming. Good luck to all at AC, Jazz, Jetz, Tango, ACTS, the Hangar, ZIP, Aeroplan ...... and especially, good luck to you, KM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lupin Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 the only parked RJ's I have seen, were down because of engines.Air Canada was low on Engines and alot of skidoos need their engines replaced before the end of the year.We were stealing the engines from the aircrafts in c check to keep the other ones flying. No other airplanes are parked in yul Lupin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudder Posted October 18, 2003 Author Share Posted October 18, 2003 'parked' is a relative term. For example, if it were possible for AC to operate each RJ 250 hours per month but were actually only operating them 200 hours per month due to lack of fight crews, then this has the same effect as 'parking' several airframes in a 25 aircraft fleet. Either way, the lease cost is fixed and therefore the per block hour operating costs for the RJ fleet go up due to underutilisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudder Posted October 18, 2003 Author Share Posted October 18, 2003 Labtec, "The prospect of going from a 90k/year job to a 40k/year job earning less than the F/A's has caused alot of guys to look at the quality of AC as an employer. My suspicion is that most will not return if called back. Giguere and the boys are turning the place into a second rate airline from a pilots perspective....Under no circumstances should a pilot earn less than a flight attendant and that is what Air Canada has done." Since this is the deal for the next 6 years (or 3 years until the wage re-opener), what do you suggest is the solution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudder Posted October 18, 2003 Author Share Posted October 18, 2003 Labtec, "The prospect of going from a 90k/year job to a 40k/year job earning less than the F/A's has caused alot of guys to look at the quality of AC as an employer. My suspicion is that most will not return if called back. Giguere and the boys are turning the place into a second rate airline from a pilots perspective....Under no circumstances should a pilot earn less than a flight attendant and that is what Air Canada has done." Since this is the deal for the next 6 years (or 3 years until the wage re-opener), what do you suggest is the solution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Crow Posted October 18, 2003 Share Posted October 18, 2003 You guys should all take it outside in the parking lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 "Labtec, let me let you in on a little secret, we are not paying for our lawyers" ???????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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