Mitch Cronin Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Yesterday... and a week or so ago as well... I had a chance to fly a 767. ... I was scheduled for run training on both the CF6 and Pratt sims, and after torturous sessions, in which everything that could go wrong, did (as the instructor would have it no other way!, lest I learn nothing...) ....fortune gave enough time for some "beyond our scope" experiences... Hot Damn! What a gas! 3 times in all... (hey, even all you old hands must've once been thrilled at the notion?)... I took off, did a circuit and came back, all by the seat of my pants so to speak... only ever looked at airspeed and altitude... and landed the bugger just fine! (sorta?) I've tried other sims before during free moments in other similar training experiences... A320: bloody "alpha floor protection" wouldn't let me stall it on from a couple feet... instant unwanted go-around. DC10:... instructor figured me for a hot-shot, so he set me up on short final in the clouds... I found the runway, but probably drove the gear up through the wings... 737-200: Piece of cake and a beautiful experience! A sports car airplane, at least it is for the green 130hr hasn't-flow-for-years C150 pilot like me... maybe others too? No sweat at all... The 67 wasn't what I'd call easy, but seemed pretty damned real! My last landing (after finding the runway again from a 1000 ft circuit ) I was nowhere near any reasonable speed, so I dropped the gear, full flaps, full spoilers, and found myself down to 140 about 200 ft short of the runway... didn't apply enough power soon enough and wound up stalling onto the button from about 20 ft ... according to the sim experience, it was not too bad.... but I've got a hunch a heavy landing inspection might've found a few areas of concern.... I'd better leave that stuff to you guys, and stick with playing with wrenches and things on the ground. Prior to these experiences, I'd had the impression that I'd need the bonneville salt flats to attempt landing one of those things.... now I know my chances of survival might actually be pretty good. If I ever get the chance to fulfill every private pilot's most intimate wet dream... (The gorgeous flight attendant says: "Ladies and gentleman, our pilots have both become incapacitated, can anyone on board fly this airplane?" Looking at you with take me eyes...)... I'd be confident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B75/76 Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Please, Mitch. Don't be letting our secret out! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pikachu Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Speaking of heavy landing checks... How does maintenance know when to do one? Is it solely based on the flightcrew's admission (like that will ever happen) of pounding one on? I heard the 737-200 has a pin of some sort that pops out on a hard landing which in turn triggers a heavy land check. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B75/76 Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Canya push the 'pin' back in?!!! :-O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted April 15, 2004 Author Share Posted April 15, 2004 I don't recall such a device on the 737-200's, but that doesn't mean it didn't exist, just that my memory isn't there at the moment... been a while... I do recall the DC10's had such a thing on the center gear... and there's a pop-out indicator on the tail-skid of the 67's... (as if you wouldn't know that sucker had been hammered otherwise?.... in line with the "Window is not closed" sign on the cockpit window frame) So unless the recorders record a heavy g landing (as a lot of new generation machines do), it's up to the reports from the honest blokes up front... and the dilligence of the grunts on the floor doing the inspecting, on many machines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicoChico Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Some fun eh Mitch? Not that I want to split hairs....oh what the heck I'm splittin em. You had to attempt your A320 stall onto runway manoever from above 50' agl otherwise the Alpha floor protection would not have kicked in. (otherwise it might be impossible to land the aircraft if low speed protection applied full power in the flare!) Below 50 AGL it IS possible to stall the aircraft since pitch control is phased in to a direct "stick to elevator" response (Something like a TREX ) It is routine (for some) to have full aft stick applied right at touchdown which will faciltate a fairly smooth landing. One wouldn't want to apply that back stick until the very very last moment though, since (if applied too early) it will serve to get the nose up in the "tail striking the runway attitude", particularly on the A321 or even A320. Believe it or not the A320 is almost a conventional aircraft below 50' AGL (can't believe I said that!) unless we want to discuss FLARE LAW... Cheers Chico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted April 15, 2004 Author Share Posted April 15, 2004 Hey, those hairs were worth splitting!... Greater than 50 ft eh?... Ok, so the bugger might've known best?... I didn't tell you about the second attempt in the A320,... after floating past 120 percent or so of the available runway, bleeding off speed, I managed a beautifully gentle touchdown in the grass beyond. I guess I should've looked at the airspeed a little more critically. It's just my overwhelming whim, each time I've had the chance, has been to do it by eyes and butt alone... need more time for that in that machine, but in the '37 and apparently the '67, I found it do-able. Now I'm lookin' forward to the next chance I get in the 320.... if that should ever happen?.... What's a good approach speed? Yessir, great fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicoChico Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 Ballpark for average weight about 140 to 150 (pretty fast!) Most of the time we are using managed speed and auto-thrust so the approach speed is "whatever the FMGC computes it to be plus whatever additive is applied to that i.e Groundspeed mini)" As far as hand-flying the 320 and manually managing the airspeed - that is a handfull for most of us!! It does land very nicely in the grass though C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dork Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 That is great..it sure is fun to fly the old gal. I did many an engine swap with the mechs at 2 Airforces and it was super to learn about their magic. Just brought the old 67 into YYT today with the usual gusty winds...just happy to put her back on the earth. Mitch you seem to get the best out of life and share it with others. Great story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp fa Posted April 15, 2004 Share Posted April 15, 2004 (The gorgeous flight attendant says: "Ladies and gentleman, our pilots have both become incapacitated, can anyone on board fly this airplane?" Looking at you with take me eyes...)... Not to burst your bubble, but I see you waving your arms madly, saying "Pick me, coach!" and the flight attendant looking at you incredulously saying "I just brought you your third rum and coke." I personally would be scouring the cabin for the geekiest looking Air Cadet I could find, who spends all his spare time playing flight sim. Glad you finally got a chance to go in the sim - I'd been hoping you would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Cronin Posted April 15, 2004 Author Share Posted April 15, 2004 Hey!... That's not how the fantasy goes!.... (bubble bursting) ...anyway, I don't think I've ever had more than two on any bird... She's wrong I tell ya! It was the geek that had 3! (Now I'll go back and read Dork's response again to feel better... Thanks Dork, I try. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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