Guest lizard Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 I went to the YUL roadshow today, great turnout! One very important change to reserve that is of interest, which is not written in the TA: When an f/a gets called out on reserve, he/she will now have to call crew sked at the end of the assigned flights to see if there's any more flying to do. If you have a stretch of reserve, crew sked can then send you on a 4-day pairing. In other words, I may chose to do a single day pairing on reserve, but I will not know when I'll be released from duty, nor if I will even go home that night. Apparently, if crew sked decides to overnight you, they must give you three hours to go home and pick up your overnight bag (not much consolation if you are one of the many who uses public transportation to get to work). Also, for this to happen, there should not be anyone else junior on reserve who can do that flying. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S. Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Sounds like a little more flexibility that will probably be used about 1% of the time. As was said before - if you want to find one little bit of the TA that you don't like and vote down your whole career over that one wee item.... then you probably shouldn't be in the industry anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peanuts Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 hi Lizard, The change to Reserve was outlined in the TA that we (should) have all received. It does give crew sked more flexibility to utilize their Reserves. My advice ; Don't ever pee off crew sched if you are sitting on Reserve ! I have bid Reserve for the past 2.5 years and will continue to bid it. There is still the fact that they can not use you more then any other f/a who bids a block. (up to 85 credits that is) It will be interesting, but not worrysome ! Hang in there lizard, things will be just fine. We haven't had our meetings yet, but I am sure looking forward to them. Especially the cocktail after Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rance Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Hi John s: "Sounds like a little more flexibility that will probably be used about 1% of the time". obviously you haven't been on jr. reserve in quite awhile.It definately sucks going in for an afternoon pairing and coming home 4 days later. "if you want to find one little bit of the TA that you don't like and vote down your whole career over that one wee item.... then you probably shouldn't be in the industry anyway". easy big fella.I can't speak for lizard, but i think she was just asking others for their opinion on the topic.There was no mention of turning down the t/a. try a little decaf.(yellow smiley face). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jazzpilot Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Rance: Consider the fact that if Jazz is able to move forward there will be more aircraft(with two f/a's). That means the reserve people now become block holders, and the block holders now get better schedules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ThinFin Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Every-body take a deep breath! Okay 1234,1234. Are you still with me? This is not about negotiations folks! Hello ACPA and hello TEAMSTERS, this is about survival. If you consider the alternatives, they ain't pretty, so maybe it is time to give your head a shake.I know your &%$@! at me and so be it, but just think of the other possibilities. To Bad So Sad!!!! Cheers; Fin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peanuts Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 HELLOOOOOOO Thinfin, Good God where do you get off spouting off all these accusations ? Can you read ? Folks were simply mentioning some of the changes to the Reserve. Watch your language. There really wasn't any need for that to these postings ! Take a pill, have a drink or go sit in the bathroom for a while ! Just don't bother acting the way you are when it is NOT justified. I have taken great offense by your posting ! Now why on earth would I be angry with you ? Give your own head a shake. Take care, A "yes" voter at Jazz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 "obviously you haven't been on jr. reserve in quite awhile.It definately sucks going in for an afternoon pairing and coming home 4 days later." FYI From a pilots perspective: It wasn't until approx 1997 that the AO pilots began to enjoy relief from the clause that is now causing you distress. As a matter of fact, the most senior blockholder was also subjected to this same type of screw around. Further, back in the eighties we complained and recieved a memo from the boss that said "when you check in pack for six days regardless of the segment you're scheduled for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Nova Zemlya Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 This is not a rant about how senior people are vastly more priviledged than junior. Though, to tell the truth, I could fill a page on that subject. What I find curious is how a single individual in the management of the fringe festival could jeopardize a company with $10 bil. in revenue, the approbation of Seabury, and a surge in internet bookings because of their insistance upon taking an extremist attitude and consistently breaking the contract of the regional F/A's only because they felt they could get away with it. Most of the people who are inclined to say NO have already faced CCAA before to no result for all of their pains, except to see managment use them as a welcome mat during the merge, after conditions had improved. Now they feel betrayed by both the union and management. I don't blame them at all for taking a hard line. That's what the NO vote is all about, and because of the hard line attitude of the management towards its employees, we might just all lose our jobs. This is not because of some kind of childish militancy on the part of the regional F/A's. Just a foolish miscalculation on the part of a single, unethical conservative with a political agenda to fulfill. Has anybody even considered that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jazz1 Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Big if on the a/c with two f/a's and 90+ lay-offs to happen first. You pilots couldn't give a SH#T what the f/a's give up just so you could get your hands on a shiny new toy. Also, you will realize a pay increase in the fourth year of your TA and will be at plus 3.5% of today’s rates in 2008 whereas the f/a’s are supposed to give up 7.5% on today’s rates and forgo a 1.5% and 2.5% increase for 2003 and 2004 which puts us down 11.5% on wages alone. So keep your pilot opinion to yourself! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rance Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Jazzpilot; i wasn't disputing any of this.I was just addressing johns comments to lizard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest givemeabreak Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 So you are finally getting reality pay Jazz1. Live with it or quit. We don't want your attitude anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Gapper Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Defcon, at the regional formerly known as the most profitable,heh heh!!! Under our last contract, reserve rules were such that you never came to work on reserve without your overnight bag. Especially if the next day wasn't a day off. ie called in for 1 gone for 6. I didn't like it but it makes sense for efficiency, based on my 2.5 years straight of reserve experience. I was surprised not to see this in our new TA again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest skies Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Hello lizard, Yes it is written in the TA...5.23.07 "It is a flight attendants responsability to contact Crew Scheduling after completion of the original awarded assignment to see if further duty is required and the flight attendant can be subject to further asssignment to the maximum duty day." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jazzpilot Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Jazz1: I like most pilots don't give a rats a$$ about "shiny new toys". If we did we wouldn't have hung around to fly these old -100's. This is about renewal and expansion or the failure of the company. Which will you pick? In regards to the percentage of salary that you are losing, guess what? The pilots are taking over 50% of the total cost reductions despite being only 1/4-1/3 of the work force. Yes we make more on average then the other groups so we should take a larger hit. But to pretend that we are affected less then the others is BS. Your union was given a number to target just like all the other groups. This was not negotiable. What was negotiable was how they met those targets. I have seen your TA and while the Teamster's approach was different, the end result was the same. Pain for everyone. What you all need to ask yourselves is can I replace this job with all the benefits in two weeks. For the vast majority the answer is no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lizard Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Thanks rance, that's exactly what I was trying to say. As for voting, I voted "yes" today (sorry jzdude!), not because I liked the agreement, but because I cannot speak for everyone else. Those who can live with it, will stay. Those who can't, will find another job. And for those who think that all we can do is suggest that you add some fries to your order, well, you're just wrong. Most of the f/a's that were hired in my time have university degrees. So there! Rant over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CleardecksforACTION! Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Jazz1: You are a twerp. You've seen the TA and think you know of what you speak. You forget to mention that you'll have a wage re-opener in three years. The pilots will not. You say that you'll have to forgo scheduled increases ('till the wage re-opener), well so do the pilots! The pilots go to -7.5% of current at the same time as a scheduled 2.5% increase. This means a constant -10% over previously negotiated,; and there is no wage re-opener 'til 2009. The last increase you mention which gives the pilots +3.5% of current is still $2.50/hr less than the rate negotiated for Jul.'04...but it's SIX YEARS from now! If inflation runs at 2.5%/yr that would be the equivalent of a futher 18% reduction (compounded) to todays dollar. This in addition to the origional cut. The mainline pilots are being asked for a 16% cut with a FREEZE for three years ('til their wage re-opener). Figure out what that total contribution adds up to! I've taken a good look at the teamsters TA and you folk are pulling the same weight as everybody else, no more, no less. Some took smaller % cuts, but larger lay-offs. As for the 10cents/hr per FA that teamsters get, it might be a symbolic gesture to drop it, however I can't think of any possible way of redistributing it back to the membership as anything other than at 10 cents per hr, and I somehow doubt that would satisfy you. I get the feeling that you are just' lashing out at anything and everything with no forethought or oversight. You've obviously made your choice and I can't describe what low esteem I hold you in with this campaign (of an ignoramus). Cheerio! CDFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CleardecksforACTION! Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Jazz1: You are a twerp. You've seen the TA and think you know of what you speak. You forget to mention that you'll have a wage re-opener in three years. The pilots will not. You say that you'll have to forgo scheduled increases ('till the wage re-opener), well so do the pilots! The pilots go to -7.5% of current at the same time as a scheduled 2.5% increase. This means a constant -10% over previously negotiated,; and there is no wage re-opener 'til 2009. The last increase you mention which gives the pilots +3.5% of current is still $2.50/hr less than the rate negotiated for Jul.'04...but it's SIX YEARS from now! If inflation runs at 2.5%/yr that would be the equivalent of a futher 18% reduction (compounded) to todays dollar. This in addition to the origional cut. The mainline pilots are being asked for a 16% cut with a FREEZE for three years ('til their wage re-opener). Figure out what that total contribution adds up to! I've taken a good look at the teamsters TA and you folk are pulling the same weight as everybody else, no more, no less. Some took smaller % cuts, but larger lay-offs. As for the 10cents/hr per FA that teamsters get, it might be a symbolic gesture to drop it, however I can't think of any possible way of redistributing it back to the membership as anything other than at 10 cents per hr, and I somehow doubt that would satisfy you. I get the feeling that you are just' lashing out at anything and everything with no forethought or oversight. You've obviously made your choice and I can't describe what low esteem I hold you in with this campaign (of an ignoramus). Cheerio! CDFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theman Posted June 14, 2003 Share Posted June 14, 2003 Good post .skies. that's the end of people on R who flies 10 days a year!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theman Posted June 14, 2003 Share Posted June 14, 2003 g.m.a.b. At JAZZ we should earn more than some people who are doing just 2 flights a day!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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