Guest DynaGlider Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 Heard that Jazz is considering a base in YOW, hoping that employees will "voluntarily" move and therefore minimize contract related moving expenses. Comments??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DynaGlider Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 I should say "crew base". This would get employees away from both coasts and one step closer to where they are really wanted, ie: the center of the universe, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest floatrr Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 Yes, I could see such a move. ALPA would probably cave and sign an LOU to negate any moving expenses so JAZZ would be favoured in the eyes of the stakeholders and judges. (yea right!) I would be surprised to see any good things happen at JAZZ just because they gave major contract concessions. It seems like you give,give,give and nothing good comes of it. How about give no more and the CCAA team can show the employeees what their intentions with this restructuring really are?? AC may be closer to profitability , but it is over the backs of the employees that this has been made possible. Nothing much has really changed in the structure of the mother corp. to convince me that the employee concessions were not given in vain, YET. Time for the company and creditors to play their hand before they ask for more out of the employees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ABC Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 You said, "AC may be closer to profitability , but it is over the backs of the employees that this has been made possible." It may be a bit out of context,but isn't that the point of having employees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest floatrr Posted October 19, 2003 Share Posted October 19, 2003 Well, yes I agree with you somewhat. Here's a question for you. Is it the sole responsibility for the employee to shoulder the company's profitability? Or would it have something to do with the effectiveness of the business plan created and implemented by management? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ABC Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 I'm too "old school" for this floatr. Gentleman A starts a business and is making lots of money at it. Now he wants to expand, to make more money. But since he is already working 24/7, he needs employees. He thinks that if he finds the right manager to run his business, he can take a day or two off each week (or hopefully retire). The manager is responsible for hiring the employees. Carefully screened these people will continue the same work ethic as the original entrepreneur... Okay, so I'll give you that. Management has to have a plan. But the employees must also be there to generate the profit, in a perfect world, shared by all. Sounds a little like Westjet. But your post that profit is off the backs of employees still stands: employees are hired to become profit-generators for a company. They are not hired to be liabilities/responsibilities/profit-burdens. Perhaps you are saying that AC is nearing profitability due to the sacrifices made by the employees at the Jazz division. But I think any business person would agree, I'll hire person A at an expense of $30,000/yr if my revenue increases by $30,001/yr. A million of these employees adds $30 billion of expense and $30.001 billion of revenue ($1,000,000 profit). Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest acj Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 Nope. Jazz has cut into YOW flying big time, reduced YTZ and abolished YOW-YXU . Not a good move - not a valid rumour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest floatrr Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 "Perhaps you are saying that AC is nearing profitability due to the sacrifices made by the employees at the Jazz division." Exactly, but not only the JAZZ division. What seems to be frustrating ,as posted in the above thread "AC Seat Sale" by the likes of Mitch Cronin, is that it seems the company can easily make decisions to P1ss that money away that they saved over the backs of those employees. It's high time for the heads of the company to do the resposible thing with the savings, whatever that might be. I don't think it's selling seats at below their cost. If they want to sell a seat for that cost , then they must somehow lower their cost per seat mile,and I can't really see that happening at the mailine. The only hope is that JAZZ can come closer to WJ's CSM and be given the tools to sucessfully compete. Clive is no dummy. AC should concentrate on what it does best,(Long Haul) and let the regionals compete with the likes of WJ ,Jetsgo etc. IMHO. Goodnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest floatrr Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 "Perhaps you are saying that AC is nearing profitability due to the sacrifices made by the employees at the Jazz division." Exactly, but not only the JAZZ division. What seems to be frustrating ,as posted in the above thread "AC Seat Sale" by the likes of Mitch Cronin, is that it seems the company can easily make decisions to P1ss that money away that they saved over the backs of those employees. It's high time for the heads of the company to do the responsible thing with the savings, whatever that might be. I don't think it's selling seats at below their cost. If they want to sell a seat for that cost , then they must somehow lower their cost per seat mile,and I can't really see that happening at the mailine. The only hope is that JAZZ can come closer to WJ's CSM and be given the tools to sucessfully compete. Clive is no dummy. AC should concentrate on what it does best,(Long Haul) and let the regionals compete with the likes of WJ ,Jetsgo etc. IMHO. Goodnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.70 mach Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 " The only hope is that JAZZ can come closer to WJ's CSM and be given the tools to successfully compete. Clive is no dummy. AC should concentrate on what it does best,(Long Haul) and let the regionals compete with the likes of WJ ,Jetsgo " My only comment here is, I think the Mainline, Zip and even Jazz should collectively put there heads together to compete against the likes of Westjet, Canjet, Jets Go ...ect. Giving the consumers a choice to fly on a brand new 737-700 or a CRJ aircraft, be it even a 700 is not even in the same ballpark. I know our argument is we will offer more frequency but lets be realistic. This past summer I was going out to a family wedding in Kelowna with the wife and the young one. It being pretty tight on passes I bought tickets on Westjet. Two words ..."Very Satisfied". I now know what kind of an uphill battle us at AC/JAZZ are facing. Myself being at Jazz on the CRJ am now convinced that our role is not to compete directly against Westjet but to supplement the service provided by the Mainline. IMHO Cheers .70 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.70 mach Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 " The only hope is that JAZZ can come closer to WJ's CSM and be given the tools to successfully compete. Clive is no dummy. AC should concentrate on what it does best,(Long Haul) and let the regionals compete with the likes of WJ ,Jetsgo " My only comment here is, I think the Mainline, Zip and even Jazz should collectively put there heads together to compete against the likes of Westjet, Canjet, Jets Go ...ect. Giving the consumers a choice to fly on a brand new 737-700 or a CRJ aircraft, be it even a 700 is not even in the same ballpark. I know our argument is we will offer more frequency but lets be realistic. This past summer I was going out to a family wedding in Kelowna with the wife and the young one. It being pretty tight on passes I bought tickets on Westjet. Two words ..."Very Satisfied". I now know what kind of an uphill battle us at AC/JAZZ are facing. Myself being at Jazz on the CRJ am now convinced that our role is not to compete directly against Westjet but to supplement the service provided by the Mainline. IMHO Cheers .70 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Virtual Posted October 20, 2003 Share Posted October 20, 2003 "It being pretty tight on passes, I bought tickets on WestJet." Interesting. Why wouldn't you buy tickets on AC and support your own employer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.70 mach Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I almost always use the passes for personal travel or AC family affair, but being that I had to get to Kelowna a wedding having a seat was a priority. That said, Zip/AC was $423.00 more expensive for the total ticket price for the three of us. The schedule was better for us as well with my first flight on a 737-700 out of Toronto and a smooth connection to Kelowna made for an easy decision. Remember my first choice is always AC. But it was refreshing how good the service was and that's reason they continue to make a profit in my humble opinion. Cheers .70 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.70 mach Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I almost always use the passes for personal travel or AC family affair, but being that I had to get to Kelowna for a wedding having a seat was a priority. That said, Zip/AC was $423.00 more expensive for the total ticket price for the three of us. The schedule was better for us as well with my first flight on a 737-700 out of Toronto and a smooth connection to Kelowna made for an easy decision. Remember my first choice is always AC. But it was refreshing how good the service was and that's reason they continue to make a profit in my humble opinion. Cheers .70 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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