Guest neo Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Regardless of your beliefs around what the Keller Award may be, or how you intend to vote on the T.A., I cannot urge you strongly enough to make sure you know what's in the Keller Award before you vote on the T.A. You deserve to have all the facts about your job and career in front of you before you make a decision. NO ONE deserves anything less than that. Richard Roskell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sidekick Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Richard, with all due respect what does the Keller Award and the T.A. have in common. Other than try to sink the whole airline if you're going down. Save the airline first and then get ready for round four. Things tend to change pretty quick in this business so lets' give it a chance. Hell it sure can't get any worse! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S. Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 You may not get the Keller award in time to vote on the TA. This could turn into an ACPA strategic advantage. It seems to me that one of ACPA's strategies is to wait until the very lat minute to make a deal. And then don't make it. Then, just at the deadline make another suggestion for a deal. Then, once that deadline has gone and the opposite party is about to walk away, agree to a deal that is the best you can get at the time. Perhaps it's a good strategy. (The only time it has not worked to perfection is when the silly management forced you out on a strike.) So why not hold off of the Keller award for now, get all other unions to agree to their TA's and then, when you are in the position of most-powerful-once-again, then offer to take the TA to a vote. Oh, and of course let it be known that a disgruntled workforce would not likely vote in favor of the TA. And if Keller causes Neo ANY hardships then the whole 'original AC' voting block would likely be disgruntled. The perfect strategy. Except for one wrinkle. ACPA is not dealing with just the AC Mainline management, but also the creditors and judges. Plus there seems to be some somewhat ridiculous ideas in the works for a new cost effective national airline. Than again, some of the best plans start with ridiculous ideas. (Like: who thought up the idea that growing weedy grape vines could result in the pleasure of fine wine?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neo Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 I have no problem with your point of view at all, Sidekick. If you consciously choose to accept the T.A. REGARDLESS of what's in the Keller Award, then that's absolutely your perogative. It's not my recommendation, but your choice is your own, of course. neo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Virtual Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Of course, the following is just i.m.h.o.... and I'm sure several of you will try to correct me if you think I am wrong. However I am under the impression that ACPA MEC signed the TA without knowing what was going to happen with the Keller Award. So, why should I do any differently. They did not say it would be a YES if things in the Keller Award went in one direction or NO if things went in the other direction. To me, these are two separate issues that should be treated as such. In spite of the negative impact this may have on my career, and if all the different legal resources and avenues have been used by both 'sides', then let's begin looking forward. There are not 40 000 people being affected here - but 40 000 families. The single parent working the counter, etc. does not need to pay for my union or my seniority 'issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest floatrr Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 It's nice to see someone can put their own differences aside and make a decision that will see the company survive. I hope the ones considering a NO vote on the TA are WELL PREPARED FINANCIALLY to lose their job. It is my belief that the naysayers against the TA just due to the Keller decision, are a minority. Shows thinking with lack of dimension. Most of the pilots I know at AC have more common sense than that. If I'm wrong, the sum $1800. on those EI cheques will likely cause liqudation on a few other fronts. ie. House,Car, Sailboat, Summer Home,(the dog will probably stay) you know. Then it starts sounding like a country song. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nozel Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Aircanada is funding the Keller vs Mitchnick battle for the corp and for the pilots...part of your salaries are funding ACPA's lawyers to battle it out in court! If the rest of us had the same funding to do battle where would we be? Some points worth reflecting upon: A relative few disgruntled of your rank and file could very well upset the lively hoods/careers of the majority. Without Ramp, Cargo, Reservations, Maintenance and other hidden departments there would be no airline therefor Keller vs Mitchnick would be a moot point! Further, you are employees not employers dictating employment terms. You are along for the ride and if the ride included a merger, date of hire is the only compromise for merging your seniority lists. Mergers or buy outs are a bitter pill for all employees (pilots down to groomers) Your sand box is only so big...deal with it and get on with it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Virtual Posted June 12, 2003 Share Posted June 12, 2003 Not sure if you (mis)understood, but when I was referring to the single parent not 'paying' for my seniority issues...I did not mean in a monetary way but in the resulting consequences if AC liquidated on NO vote for the TA. Sorry if I misinterpreted you misinterpreting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neo Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 My goodness, John. With Machiavellian thinking like that, you really should have been an ACPA pilot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S. Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 ...Machiavellian thinking... I'm just a regurgitator of information, a reader of rumors, a reserve pilot with a keyboard, a messenger. And you KNOW how the forum readers just love messengers. ...really should have been an ACPA pilot. Might still happen. Just depends on which union represents the new cost effective national airline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neo Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Yes, at times I find the love almost overwhelming. Someone... (sniff) please pass the hankies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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