Guest Ben Dover Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 As an AC pilot, I have this to say. 1.) ACPA will not be there for you when the doors are shut. They will vaporize; cease to exist. 2.) There was never a “new” Eastern, Canada 3000, or Pan Am, was there? 3.) If there ends up being a new Air Canada, they will hire who they want; people with the right type rating on their license, young folk, and they will also probably steer clear of hiring ex ACPA types. They will NOT hire back in order of seniority. There may not even be any union representation at the new company; just like WJ. They might even end up paying less than WJ. How would you like to be making $40,000 a year for ever? Or maybe pay a $40,000 bond for training? Don’t think it’s possible? Anything is possible in aviation! 4.) If you think you’ll hate your new job so much, why don’t you just vote “yes” and then actively start looking for a new one? Your chances of getting a new job are a lot better doing that as opposed to trying to vie for a pilot job along with 3500 other highly-qualified unemployed pilots in a thin market with a license that goes stale by the day. 5.) You seem to believe you have the choice of throwing in the towel. By voting “no” you are screwing with the lives of many AC pilots who believe that they do not have that choice. I need this job, irregardless of how much it pays, because I know that it will take me forever to find another job. There are still many C3 pilots who are out on the street. It’s been over 2 years, hasn’t it? Just think about the job market saturation if all of us end up looking? Some of us will never find work in aviation again. Taking a risk of that magnitude without the distinct possibility of substantial gain is foolish. 6.) The EXECUTIVES and the pilots are being asked to take a larger pay cut because we are the highest paid group in the company. Right or wrong, that’s what it boils down to. We’ll still be making a pretty penny. 7.) The model will be fixed, profits will be made, and we will make gains on our contract in the future. The Dalai Lama once said that one of the roads to happiness is realizing what you have instead of what you don’t have. Given the worst case scenario, we will still be a lot better off than most of the people on earth. Lifestyles require adjustment sometimes. The happiest people I’ve ever seen were in a third world country where their per month family income was $40 US. They had no electricity or running water, but they had each other and their health. 8.) Start looking on the bright side of things. You’ll live a happier, longer, and healthier life. Negativism is like a disease. It spreads quickly. If you had AIDS or SARS, you wouldn’t want to go around infecting people with those diseases, would you? Spreading misery and negative energy can be just as hazardous. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ben Dover Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I should add that I’d be one of the guys getting laid off as it stands, but I figure we’re looking at around 400 after retirements LOAs. Given the current number of retirements, that would work out to a max of 4 years for the most junior guy. That’s plenty of time to try and find a new job, and if it doesn’t work out, at least they have the option of eventually returning to AC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest CleardecksforACTION! Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K99 Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 It seems to me that people out there are missing something. From the people I've talked to who are familliar with these types of situatons, the members will not be allowed to vote on this one. It's a take it or leave it deal. The company and the judge has told the MEC that you decide for your members. For the first time a decision is in the hands of our leaders and only them. I'm wondering if we said no to the deal would not the Judge simply say "OK you remember those parts of the initial order that were in limbo? Well there not any more they are back in." Then rather than liquidating management would be allowed to rewrite the contract as they see fit. ie layoff out of senority et al. That could produce a contract far worse than what has been proposed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCDU Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Or- he could see what the union brought back and impose something in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ben Dover Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I, for one, am not a card playing man. The stakes are way to high in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starman Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 First prize for most appropriate handle on this forum ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Starman Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 First prize for most appropriate handle on this forum ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wilber Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 If that is the case then why are the judge and company even bothering to talk to the MEC or employees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airmail Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Because just like under Chapter 11, there has to be a period of negotiations and the extraordinary powers are only used as a last resort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Airmail Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Because just like under Chapter 11, there has to be a period of negotiations and the extraordinary powers are only used as a last resort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jimmy Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Dear Ben: Since you are poised for the buggering and you relaxed and expecting it, maybe it won't hurt so much. Good luck with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tri-spool Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Airmail, Do you really consider this negotiations. Here's the deal, take it or leave it. If you leave it we liquidate! Hmmm! Ouch all over! Cheers, dude! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wilber Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 Since when did a take it or leave it ultimatum made with a judge's backing become a negotiation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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