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We have all seen gas prices at the pump escalate but we hear nothing about AV gas.......

Normally we hear that ticket prices are going up when gas goes up, especially at the rate we are seeing to-day, or does the price of "road" gas have no effect on the price of  AV gas ??

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U.S. Airlines’ March 2022 Fuel Consumption Down 10% from Pre-Pandemic 2019; Aviation Fuel Cost per Gallon Hits 8-year High

ttps://www.bts.gov/newsroom/us-airlines-march-2022-fuel-consumption-down-10-pre-pandemic-2019-aviation-fuel-cost#:~:text=The%20cost%20per%20gallon%20of,50.5%25)%20from%20March%202019.

Airline Fuel Cost and Consumption (U.S. Carriers - Scheduled)
January 2000 - March 2022

OST_R | BTS | Transtats

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, Kip Powick said:

Thanks but it doesn't show how much AV gas has increased...need a baseline  for example,  01 March 2022

 

In my area, road gas has increased about 65%, since 01 March 2022 .......what is happening with AV gas ???

Hi, Kip - here's a graph for your time period. Nothing like the steep spike in mogas last few months,

image.thumb.png.d57d792fdc0369bfbc9d5c8b76739ea0.png

BUT - Here's a 1-year graph. Trend's definitely been up. The prices seem low, so I'm assuming it's airline contract prices, which are substantially lower than public retail.

image.thumb.png.04af6f2366b6d8dab63810019fc94643.png

Kerosene-Type Jet Fuel Prices: U.S. Gulf Coast (WJFUELUSGULF) | FRED | St. Louis Fed (stlouisfed.org)

Cheers, IFG :b:

p.s. I was looking into retail avgas prices several months ago in US, and they ranged north and south of $5/gal between ON & FL, self-serve at smaller airports (I think mogas was running mid-ish 2's?). If they're only $6-7 now, the increase % is definitely less than mogas - 

Edited by IFG
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Posted (edited)

Large petroleum consumers like the airlines, rail and shipping don't get the wild price swings we commoners do because they won't stand for it and their buying power gives them the clout to cut it off. Our current pump price increases aren't fully explained by the world oil price increases and carbon taxes. The last time world oil prices were at the current level (pre-COVID), we were paying about 25% less. IMO, the current consumer price is nothing more than the industry trying to claw back what the believe they lost when demand tanked in 2020.

Edited by J.O.
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22 minutes ago, J.O. said:

Large petroleum consumers like the airlines, rail and shipping don't get the wild price swings we commoners do because they won't stand for it and their buying power gives them the clout to cut it off. Our current pump price increases aren't fully explained by the world oil price increases and carbon taxes. The last time world oil prices were at the current level (pre-COVID), we were paying about 25% less. IMO, the current consumer price is nothing more than the industry trying to claw back what the believe they lost when demand tanked in 2020.

and along of course with Mr Trudeau's sin taxes.....

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Taxes aren't the problem.  It's greed...

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2022-05-09/crude-hovers-at-110-a-barrel-but-the-refinery-margin-makes-us-pay-a-lot-more?sref=5dj0X2VO

Sorry, But for You, Oil Trades at $250 a Barrel

The culprit is the refinery margin and the consequences are huge for global inflation.

May 9, 2022, 1:48 AM EDT

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Javier Blas is a Bloomberg Opinion columnist covering energy and commodities. A former reporter for Bloomberg News and commodities editor at the Financial Times, he is coauthor of “The World for Sale: Money, Power and the Traders Who Barter the Earth’s Resources.” @JavierBlas
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If you are the owner of an oil refinery, then crude is trading happily just a little above $110 a barrel — expensive, but not extortionate. If you aren’t an oil baron, I have bad news: it's as if oil is trading somewhere between $150 and $275 a barrel.

The oil market is projecting a false sense of stability when it comes to energy inflation. Instead, the real economy is suffering a much stronger price shock than it appears, because fuel prices are rising much faster than crude, and that matters for monetary policy.

Petroleum Shock

Refined oil products have risen between 30% and nearly 140% since Russia invaded Ukraine in late February, compared to less than 15% for crude.

Source: Bloomberg

 

To understand why, let’s examine the guts of the oil market: the refining industry. 

Wall Street closely monitors the price of crude, particularly a grade called West Texas Intermediate traded in New York. It’s a benchmark followed by everyone, from bond investors to central bankers. But only oil refiners buy crude — and therefore, are exposed to its price. The rest of us — the real economy — purchase refined petroleum products like gasoline, diesel and jet-fuel that we can use to run cars, trucks and airplanes. It’s those post-refinery prices that matter to us. 

Typically, the price of crude and the price of refined products go up and down in tandem, almost symmetrically. What’s in between is a refining margin. In normal times, WTI is a handy price shorthand for the entirety of the petroleum market. So when, say, U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman Jerome Powell looks at WTI, he gets a neat picture of the whole energy market. 

But we aren’t in normal times. Right now, the traditional relationship between crude and refined products is broken. WTI is anchored around $100-$110 a barrel, suggesting that — in barrel terms — gasoline, diesel and jet-fuel prices shouldn’t be much higher, once you add the average refining margin. 

In reality, they are a lot more expensive. Take jet-fuel: in New York harbor, a key hub, it’s changing hands at the equivalent to $275 per barrel. Diesel isn’t far away, at about $175 a barrel. And gasoline is at about $155 a barrel. Those are wholesale prices, before you add taxes and marketing margins. 

What’s changed? Refining margins have exploded. And that means energy inflation is far stronger than it appears. 

Oil refineries are complex machines, capable of processing multiple streams of crude into dozens of different petroleum products. For simplicity’s sake, the industry measures refining margins using a rough calculation called the “3-2-1 crack spread”: for every three barrels of WTI crude oil the refinery processes, it makes two barrels of gasoline and one barrel of distillate fuel like diesel and jet-fuel. 

Cracking Profits

Oil refiners are enjoying the best ever processing margins, lifting the cost of fuels such as gasoline, diesel and jet-fuel well above that of crude

Source: Bloomberg

Note: WTI 3-2-1 cracking margin

From 1985 to 2021, the crack spread averaged about $10.50 a barrel. Even between 2004 and 2008, during the so-called golden age of refining, the crack spread never surpassed $30. It rarely spent more than a few weeks above $20. Last week, however, the margin jumped to a record high of nearly $55. Crack margins for diesel and other petroleum products surged much higher. 

There are four main reasons behind the explosion in refining margins. 

 

First, demand — particularly for diesel —  has rebounded strongly, depleting global inventories. In some markets, like the U.S. East Coast, diesel stocks have fallen to a 30-year low. Despite rising prices and fears of an economic slowdown later this year, oil executive say they see strong consumption for now. “Demand is not that easily destroyed,” Shell Plc Chief Executive Officer Ben van Beurden told investors last week.

Second, the U.S. and its allies have tapped their strategic petroleum reserves to cap the rally in oil prices. That has provided extra crude, which has put a lid on WTI prices, but it hasn’t addressed the tightness in refined products. Only a small fraction of the emergency release is in the form of refined products, and only in Europe. 

Third, and perhaps most importantly, refining capacity has declined where it matters for the market now, and the plants that are operating are struggling to process enough crude to satisfy the demand for fuel. Martijn Rats, an oil analyst at Morgan Stanley, estimates that outside China and the Middle East, oil distillation capacity fell by 1.9 million barrels a day from the end of 2019 to today — that’s the largest decline in 30 years.

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The downward trend started well before the pandemic hit, as old Western refineries struggled to compete, environmental regulations increased costs and the unfounded fear of peak oil demand amid the energy transition prompted some companies to close plants. The fuel-demand collapse triggered by Covid-19 only turbo-charged the trend, resulting in dozens of refinery operations shutting down for good in Europe and the U.S. in 2020 and 2021. New capacity has emerged in China. However, Beijing tightly controls how much fuel its refiners can export so that capacity is effectively out of reach of the global market. 

 

“Has the oil market hit the refinery wall?,” Rats asked in a note to clients last week. “Unusually, the answer appears to be yes.”

Fourth, are the sanctions and unilateral embargos — also known as self-sanctions — on Russian oil. Before the invasion of Ukraine, Russia was a major exporter not just of crude, but also of diesel and semi-processed oil that Western refiners turned into fuel. Europe, in particular, relied on Russian refineries for a significant chunk of its diesel imports. The flow has now dried.

Europe not only needs to find extra crude to produce the diesel and other fuels it’s not buying from Russia, but, crucially, it needs the refining capacity to do so, too. It’s a double blow. Oil traders estimate that Russia has shut down 1.3 million to 1.5 million barrels a day of refining capacity as result of the self-sanctions. 

Who’s benefiting? The pure-play oil refiners, which are quietly enjoying record-high profit margins. While OPEC and Big Oil get the blame, independent refiners are cashing-in. The sky-high crack margins explains why the share prices of U.S. refining giants Marathon Petroleum Corp. and Valero Energy Corp. have surged to all-time highs. The longer the refiners make super-profits, the harder the energy shock will hit the economy. The only solution is to lower demand. For that, however, a recession will be necessary. 

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On 5/23/2022 at 5:46 AM, AAS said:

What’s the price at a marina? 
I haven’t been up to the cottage yet. 

Some marinas in BC are charging over $2.50 per litre for marine diesel. My neighbours just cancelled their planned trip around Vancouver Island in their cruiser.

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47 minutes ago, J.O. said:

Some marinas in BC are charging over $2.50 per litre for marine diesel. My neighbours just cancelled their planned trip around Vancouver Island in their cruiser.

Time to trade up to sail.  😀

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On 5/24/2022 at 12:00 PM, Kargokings said:

Time to trade up to sail.  😀

I'd rather paddle ..😉

I remember decades ago watching a beautiful cruiser going across the Bay of Quinte, the vessel was about 40-45 feet long. I causally asked the guy I was with, "I wonder how many miles to the gallon he gets?"

His reply was, " If that is your biggest concern, you can't afford the boat"

He was/is  correct,

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1 hour ago, Kip Powick said:

I'd rather paddle ..😉

I remember decades ago watching a beautiful cruiser going across the Bay of Quinte, the vessel was about 40-45 feet long. I causally asked the guy I was with, "I wonder how many miles to the gallon he gets?"

His reply was, " If that is your biggest concern, you can't afford the boat"

He was/is  correct,

How about this mod?

 

boat invited.jpg

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Right now, it’s better to be the guy that brings the refreshments to their friend’s boat than it is to be the friend with the boat (financially that is). 

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https://www.autotrader.ca/editorial/20170302/how-much-does-it-really-cost-to-charge-that-electric-vehicle/

How Much Does It Really Cost to Charge That Electric Vehicle?

CAR BUYING TIPS
March 01, 2022
By Evan Williams
 

Update (February 28, 2022): With more EVs on the road in 2022 than in 2017, along with big changes in the cost of energy, we’ve updated this guide for 2022 with new vehicles and updated power and fuel rates.

Just about every article or news piece about an electric car that we do – and there is a lot of EV news lately – gets a comment thread filled with people debating the price of charging an EV. “Hydro rates are so high,” “maybe when electricity is cheaper,” “who can afford to drive one when I can use cheaper gas,” and best of all “filling a tank with fuel is half the price of plugging in a car.”

What we realized is buyers don’t seem to know just how much it costs to charge an EV. I realized I didn’t know how much it would cost to charge an EV either. But I wanted to find out. We all know exactly how much it costs to put gas in the tank – look at the lines if there is a one-cent price jump expected overnight – but electricity is more stable and more predictable. So how much does it cost to “fill up” an electric car?

2019hondaclarityelectric01_2-source.jpg?

The Price of Power

The first step is finding the cost of electricity. In most provinces, it’s easy. Most provinces have a set rate and tax. In New Brunswick, for example, power costs $0.1076/kWh and then gets a 15 percent tax. In provinces with a flat service fee, we have ignored that cost. Since you have to pay that anyway, EV or not, we didn’t count it. One province, however, is a little more tricky.

Ontario has not just three time-of-day rates (and a new but little-used tiered system), but a patchwork of electric providers. Each has a different fee to get the power to your door, with some having multiple rates depending on where you live. That makes it difficult to calculate for every person in the province, but we can get an idea of the range for the province using a best case and a worst case. For the worst case, we used rural delivery fees and peak time rates. For the best case, we used nighttime rates with an urban delivery fee rate.

In provinces that use a different rate for your first bundle of kWh, we’ve used that lower rate. Our reasoning is that it’s impossible to say which kilowatts went where and that the differences aren’t significant to our calculations.

EV Charge Cost

The next step is finding out how much electricity a car takes to charge up. Natural Resources Canada (NRCan), the same agency that handles fuel economy ratings, does consumption ratings for electric cars. Part of their estimates is a kWh/100 km rating for all electric cars. We’ll use their city/highway combined rating as the amount of electricity used to drive 100 km.

For our calculations, we’re using two electric vehicles. The 2022 Hyundai Kona Electric and the 2022 Ford Mustang Mach-E Long Range AWD. An average BEV compact, and a more premium longer-range electric SUV. For gasoline equivalents, we have chosen the 2022 Honda Civic sedan to put next to the Kona EV. It’s the best-selling car in Canada, offering a similar cabin and footprint. To pair up with the Mach-E, we picked one of the most popular midsize crossovers in Canada. The Hyundai Santa Fe (2.5T) is a popular SUV that offers good fuel economy as well as similar overall length, width, and height.

Fuelling up our Calculators

cost-of-driving-100-km-compact.png?width

The Honda Civic is rated to get 6.9 L/100 km in combined driving (with either of its available engines). The average price of regular gasoline in Canada at the time of writing is $1.585/L. Multiplying the two numbers together gives the cost of driving 100 km – roughly $10.94 – assuming the Civic achieves its official mileage figure (rare for any gas car, but let’s assume so throughout for comparison purposes). British Columbians and Newfoundlanders, your gas is significantly more expensive than the rest of the country, so your costs would be $12.28 and $11.94 per 100 km, respectively (Alberta is the cheapest at $10.01).

A Hyundai Kona EV uses 17.4 kWh to drive 100 km. This is where the math gets trickier.

In Quebec, that’s 6.159 ¢/kWh plus eight per cent tax and it will run the meter to a total of $1.23 – almost a 90 per cent savings versus the cost of gas, in theory. But Quebec does have the cheapest rates in the country so let’s look at the worst case in rural Ontario. The highest main grid electric cost in the country is in rural areas of Ontario at peak time. Power then and there costs 20.67 ¢/kWh plus tax. Again, that’s on top of the large fixed charges, but since you aren’t unplugging your fridge anytime soon we won’t count those. So in rural Ontario, the most expensive part of the country for electricity, 100 km in a Kona EV will cost $4.06. That’s about a third of the cost to fill a gas car.

But wait, charge that car at night or any time on off-peak weekends, as most EV owners do, and the Ontario worst-case cost drops to just $2.33. If you aren’t in a rural area, the cost is just $2.03.

MORE RELATED ARTICLES

So in the best case, the Kona EV costs less than 11 per cent as much to fill as a Civic, worst case is around 38 per cent. Averaging costs across the nation, charging an electric vehicle is about 78 per cent less expensive than fuelling up a similar gasoline vehicle.

What About Bigger Vehicles?

cost-of-driving-100-km-suv.png?width=855

What about the SUVs? A Hyundai Santa Fe with the 2.5L turbo-four engine makes 277 hp and uses an estimated 9.9 L/100 km. That works out to $15.69 to drive 100 km on average ($17.62 in BC, $17.13 in NL, and $14.36 in AB). The Ford Mustang Mach-E uses 23.1 kWh/100 km, which works out to $1.64 in Quebec, $5.40 in worst case Ontario, and a national average of $3.24. Here the situation is much the same, with the cost of charging the Mach-E 79 per cent less expensive than fuelling the Santa Fe on average.

So now we know how much electric cars should cost to charge. Most EV’s come within a few cents of the cost of the two we’ve used as well because they’re all shockingly (zing!) efficient and group similarly based on their physical size and weight. They have some other tricks up their cords as well.

What About Paid Chargers?

For a start, there are thousands of chargers spread around the country. It takes some effort to find somewhere rural enough that there isn’t one nearby. Many of those chargers are Level 2 plugs that cost nothing to use. So with some planning, patience and luck, you could reduce the yearly fuelling bill to zero. Zip, zilch, nada. Many others charge by the hour, often $1 or $2 per hour. $2 per hour and an approximate rate of 30 km per hour puts the cost at around $5 for 100 km of driving.

Charging at pay-to-use Level 3 charging varies wildly. You’re charged based on time, but how much charge your vehicle can accept in that time changes based on the temperature, your current charge level, and several other factors. Because of this variability, and because several studies have shown 80 percent or more charging is done at home, we’re not going in depth on L3 charging. But, a 50-kW fast charger will add around 100 km of range in about 20 minutes, at a cost of approximately $4.50. A 350-kW charger, the fastest currently offered, can add 100 km in as little as four minutes, at a price of less than $3.

Hybrids and PHEVs Compared

gas-hybrid-phev-comparison.png?width=855

How do plug-in hybrids compare? For these calculations, we’ve used a model that is offered in gas, hybrid, and PHEV drivelines: the Toyota RAV4. It’s also Canada’s best-selling crossover, making it an even better example. The gas-powered AWD RAV4 can travel 100 km on 8.4 L of regular gas, according to NRCan. The hybrid and PHEV RAV4 Prime both use 6.0 L of regular gas to travel 100 km. But the Prime has an advantage: it can travel for the first 68 km of that trip on electric power instead, using gasoline for only the final 32 km. Measured that way, it uses 15.2 kWh of electricity and just 1.9 L of fuel.

With those figures, and the Canadian gas price average, a gas RAV4 will cost $13.31 in fuel to drive 100 km. The RAV4 Hybrid should cost $9.51, and the RAV4 Prime PHEV just $5.17.

So a 100-km trip in that plug-in hybrid would still cost more than a fully electric car, but a look at our chart shows the overall fuelling costs are definitely less than their conventional gas versions. Since most drivers only occasionally travel more than 40 km per day, the potential cost savings is even greater.

What’s the Payback?

That’s how much it costs to charge that electric car. It’s not a surprise that the EV will cost less to drive 100 km than a gas car, but it is a surprise how quickly it adds up. The savings in a single year comparing our two compacts (and the average Canadian’s 20,000 km per year distance travelled) is a worst case of $1,374 per year and a best case of $1,941. For our SUVs, the potential savings is as much as $2,811.

Add that to current federal EV incentives of up to $5,000, combined with provincial incentives as high as $8,000, and an EV can pay for itself in just a few years. Our compact car examples could reach parity in just three and a half years for buyers living in Quebec.

The best part of an EV? You’ll never have to stand beside a pump at -30°C ever again. You can even program the car to warm up while it’s still on the charger. That’s something to think about the next time you’re shopping for a new car.

Home EV Charging Cost for 100 km Range, Alphabetically by Province

Derived from NRCan data retrieved on 2022-02-25

1 2022 Hyundai Kona Electric: 17.4 kWh/100 km combined

2 2022 Ford Mustang Mach-E: 23.1 kWh/100 km combined

3 2022 Toyota RAV4 Prime (PHEV): 22.3 kWh/100 km combined, 68 km range; 6.0 L/100 km combined. Calculation assumes 68 km of pure electric operation per 100 km travelled.

4 2022 Honda Civic Sedan: 6.9 L/100 km combined

5 2022 Hyundai Santa Fe: 9.9 L/100 km combined

6 2022 Toyota RAV4 Hybrid: 6.0 L/100 km combined

  Kona Electric1 Mustang Mach-E2 RAV4 Prime3
AB $3.03   $4.03   $5.43  
BC $1.72   $2.28   $4.91  
MB $1.82   $2.41   $4.43  
NB $2.28   $3.02   $4.98  
NL $2.51   $3.33   $5.50  
NS $2.96   $3.93   $5.58  
ON (average) $3.05   $4.05   $5.67  
  Toronto off-peak   $2.03   $2.70   $4.78
  Toronto on-peak   $3.76   $4.99   $6.29
  Rural off-peak   $2.33   $3.10   $5.05
  Rural on-peak   $4.06   $5.40   $6.56
PEI $2.99   $3.96   $5.64  
QC $1.23   $1.64   $4.28  
SK $2.85   $3.78   $5.30  
National average $2.44   $3.24   $5.17  
Gas comparison $10.944 $15.695 $9.516
Annual Home EV Charging Cost, from Lowest to Highest Cost

Derived from NRCan data retrieved on 2022-02-25

1 2022 Hyundai Kona Electric: 17.4 kWh/100 km combined

2 2022 Ford Mustang Mach-E: 23.1 kWh/100 km combined

3 2022 Toyota RAV4 Prime (PHEV): 22.3 kWh/100 km combined, 68 km range; 6.0 L/100 km combined. Calculation assumes 68 km of pure electric operation per 100 km travelled.

4 2022 Honda Civic Sedan: 6.9 L/100 km combined

5 2022 Hyundai Santa Fe: 9.9 L/100 km combined

6 2022 Toyota RAV4 Hybrid: 6.0 L/100 km combined

  Kona Electric1 Mustang Mach-E2 RAV4 Prime3
QC $246   $327   $856  
BC $343   $456   $983  
MB $363   $482   $885  
NB $455   $605   $996  
NL $501   $665   $1,101  
SK $569   $756   $1,060  
NS $592   $787   $1,115  
PEI $597   $793   $1,127  
AB $607   $805   $1,085  
ON (average) $609   $809   $1,134  
  Toronto off-peak   $406   $539   $957
  Rural off-peak   $467   $620   $1,010
  Toronto on-peak   $752   $998   $1,258
  Rural on-peak   $813   $1,079   $1,311
National average $488   $648   $1,034  
Gas Comparison $2,1874 $3,1385 $1,9026
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Airlines Flying To Sri Lanka Asked To Carry Extra Fuel

PUBLISHED 6 HOURS AGO
 

With a shortage of fuel in Sri Lanka, foreign carriers have been advised to come prepared.

Photo: Getty Images

The economic crisis in Sri Lanka has severely hit its fuel supply, to the point where the country is now asking all foreign airlines to carry enough fuel for a return trip. The recommendation comes as the island nation struggles with a severe fuel shortage, which has affected aviation and most other sectors in the country.

Fill it up!

International airlines have been asked by Sri Lanka’s Civil Aviation Authority to load up on extra fuel before departing for Colombo. This is to ensure there is enough supply in the tanks to last for the return trip out of the country.

 

Simple Flying recently reported how the country’s national carrier SriLankan Airlines is forced to make a detour to South India to meet its fuel requirements for some of its long-haul flights to Europe and Australia. It seems that other carriers, too, will now have to make their own arrangements.

Rayhan Wanniappa, director of Sri Lanka’s Civil Aviation Authority, spoke with Bloomberg and explained the situation, saying,“We’ve asked airlines to carry the required fuel while operating to Sri Lanka, because there is a shortage of aviation fuel, and we have to manage the situation. Airlines are bringing certain additional supplies, while we are also providing from our stocks.”

 
 

Fuel tankering or refueling, whatever works!

Airlines flying into Sri Lanka have two choices – start with enough fuel in the tanks sufficient to come back or stop in a third country to refuel for the onward flight. Bloomberg reports that Emirates is resorting to tankering fuel from Dubai, while Singapore Airlines, too, is carrying more fuel than required for its flights to the country.

SriLankan Airlines, unfortunately, doesn’t have that option. For some of its long-haul flights, the carrier has chosen South Indian cities, such as Thiruvananthapuram and Chennai, or even Dubai as refueling destinations.

Some sources have revealed that SriLankan prefers Thiruvananthapuram to Chennai as it’s a shorter flight and also charges slightly less for fuel. The carrier has already used the city to refuel its flights to Melbourne and Frankfurt and has further confirmed that four more flights will stop there in the coming days.

Singapore Airlines is also tanking up extra fuel on flights to Colombo. Photo: Airbus
 

Deepening crisis

Sri Lanka is struggling to come up with cash to pay for oil. The country is facing shortages of some basic necessities such as electricity and facing massive inflation. As such, fuel for aircraft doesn’t seem very high on the list of priorities.

However, G.A. Chandrasiri, chairman of the Airport and Aviation Services, which operates the main airport in Colombo, maintains that “there’s been no effect in airport and airline operations” and that “this is just a preventive measure.”

Still, airlines have been advised to err on the side of caution to avoid fuel-related delays in Colombo.

Airlines Flying To Sri Lanka Asked To Carry Extra Fuel (simpleflying.com)

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Many years ago we had to tanker into LHR as they had a fuel shortage due to a fuel-farm fire. I’ve logged a few hours in the LAM hold trying to get down to MLW. ATC wouldn’t let us jettison fuel, so we had to burn it instead.

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On 5/31/2022 at 6:47 PM, Rich Pulman said:

Many years ago we had to tanker into LHR as they had a fuel shortage due to a fuel-farm fire. I’ve logged a few hours in the LAM hold trying to get down to MLW. ATC wouldn’t let us jettison fuel, so we had to burn it instead.

Kind of defeats the purpose of tankering, not to mention calling into question the airline's flight planning software. 🧐

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3 hours ago, J.O. said:

Kind of defeats the purpose of tankering, not to mention calling into question the airline's flight planning software. 🧐

Yes, the software was a little too conservative at the time. We’d get some shortcuts along the way which didn’t help. There were time we’d run the APU for a few hours just to burn off some KG. Did our best not to burn any more than needed, but still…

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