Jump to content



Recommended Posts

Quebec physicians order asks for harsher measures against the unvaccinated

By The Canadian Press and Alessia Simona Maratta  Global News
Posted January 9, 2022 11:31 am
 Updated January 9, 2022 12:11 pm

The Quebec College of Physicians is urging the province to “step up the pace” of COVID-19 measures that limit the public’s exposure to unvaccinated individuals.


“The vaccinated population can no longer suffer in silence from the constraints of sanitary measures while unvaccinated people occupy one in two beds in short-term and the majority of beds in intensive care,” wrote the Collège des médecins du Québec president, Dr. Mauril Gaudreault, on Friday.

READ MORE: Anti-vaccine protestors rally in France, tell Macron: ‘We’ll piss you off’

Health officials in Quebec say about 50 per cent of COVID-19 hospitalizations in the province are people who are unvaccinated and that those patients are occupying the majority of ICU beds, as they experience more severe symptoms of the disease.

Gaudreault’s federal counterpart, Jean-Yves Duclos, went even further, saying a potential compulsory vaccination is “the only way out” of the health crisis but noting the decision lies in the hands of the provinces.

People take part in a demonstration against the Quebec government’s measures to curb the spread of COVID-19 in Montreal, Saturday, Jan. 8, 2022. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Graham Hughes
People take part in a demonstration against the Quebec government’s measures to curb the spread of COVID-19 in Montreal, Saturday, Jan. 8, 2022. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Graham Hughes

Gaudreault said he backs Quebec’s future requirement for third doses in order to hold a vaccine passport, stating in Friday’s letter that the measure should take effect faster “and cover a vast set of shops and public places.”

Earlier this week, the provincial government announced its plans on making three doses a requirement to qualify for a vaccine passport and be considered adequately vaccinated.

That new measure, however, won’t come into effect right away to give people the time to get their booster shot.

The Quebec government also announced that proof of vaccination will be necessary to make purchases at Quebec’s liquor (SAQ) and cannabis (SQDC) retailers starting Jan. 18.

Health officials said the provincial government also plans to add non-essential services, “such as personal care,” to the list of businesses requiring the vaccine passport.

A date for when the new rule will come into effect has yet to be determined as discussions are ongoing with service industry providers.

–with files from Annabelle Olivier, Global News

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems they're still afraid to ask obvious vaccine questions but that's coming and it's the part of this I'm most interested in. It's not just one thing here, there's a whole list of things to examine. We are just beginning to scratch at the surface.

Like yo, media, where ya been bro? Welcome back:


Edited by Wolfhunter
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well it certainly hit close to home last night.

My Mother in Law suffered a mild stroke and needs an ICU bed.  I live in a fairly small town and yet they could not accommodate her in ICU at the hospital that is less than 1 Km from here house because all of the beds are taken up by unvaccinated people with COVID.  THIS IS WHY EVERYONE NEEDS TO GET VACCINATED.


  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tom Mulcair: Justin Trudeau is starting to apply the Macron formula

Tom MulcairSpecial to CTVNews.ca
Published Tuesday, January 11, 2022 9:41AM ESTLast Updated Tuesday, January 11, 2022 10:01AM EST

SAINT-SAUVEUR, QUEBEC -- As Canadians enter the third year of the pandemic, our fragile health system is beginning to buckle under the weight of the unvaccinated.

People who have chosen to refuse a free, effective vaccine are getting sick in record numbers with the Omicron variant and our overcrowded hospitals are unable to cope.

As a direct consequence, Canadians with serious diseases like cancer are being denied treatment. Some will die needlessly as a result. Their numbers just won’t appear in the official statistics as victims of the COVID-19 pandemic.

Against this backdrop, two strange political statements made their way onto the front pages in the past few days.

At a news conference, federal Health Minister Jean-Yves Duclos mused about obligatory vaccinations being the way of the future, while at the same time trying to say it’s his personal opinion.

Sorry, when you’re the national health minister of a country trying to get through a pandemic, you don’t get to have personal opinions on something as crucial as obliging people to get vaccinated. You’re expressing the view of the government.

Simultaneously, Erin O’Toole decided to take up the defence of the anti-vaxxers. It was surreal. O’Toole had mostly managed to sidestep the trap Prime Minister Justin Trudeau had set for him on this issue during the recent campaign. Now, he seemed determined to jump into it with both feet.

O’Toole has been walking a fine line. He wants to send a knowing wink to the anti-vax/anti-mask crowd, that’s well represented in his base and in his Caucus. He also needs to be reassuring to ordinary Canadians who’ve followed the rules throughout the pandemic, gotten vaccinated and are in no mood to mollycoddle the irresponsible.

O’Toole wants to get the conspiracy theorists back into the Conservative fold after losing a large number of them to the Anti-Vaxxer-in-Chief, Maxime Bernier. The reward for his efforts may be the loss of support amongst mainstream Conservatives who, like the vast majority of other Canadians, simply want everything possible to be done to bring this pandemic to an end.

The contrast between Trudeau’s health minister and Conservative Leader O’Toole couldn’t be sharper. It also makes it abundantly clear that politics is still playing a key role in the management of what should exclusively be a health issue.

Duclos is too smart and experienced not to know that obligatory vaccination is a non-starter. You’d have to be able to enforce it. With what resources? The Army?

Duclos was simply redrawing the ideological line in the sand with their principal opponent. His subtext: we’re willing to do everything that we can to end this thing, O’Toole would make it worse.

Premiers Jason Kenney and Scott Moe have come out forcefully against Duclos, Premiers Doug Ford and Blaine Higgs appear more nuanced but the subject was not dealt with during Monday’s premiers’ conference with Trudeau.

O’Toole seems more than happy to join that battle but his full-throated defence of the anti-vaxxers feels contrived. A counterpoint meant to draw some attention while taking a poke at Trudeau. It’s fallen terribly flat and he has a very tiny window of opportunity to re-calibrate.

There’s nothing more important for a political leader than the public’s perception of you. It’s not something you get to change with a black T-shirt. If people feel that you’re irresponsible, that their protection is not your number one concern, that sticks. O’Toole is not irresponsible. He’s just playing a reckless game and he’ll wind up paying a huge price for it in terms of his own credibility.

Appearing to say that not getting vaccinated is no big problem, is putting O’Toole at odds with 90% of the Canadian population.

Even folks who are vaccine-hesitant will usually do the right thing for their loved ones, their friends and their co-workers. If they’re not convinced it’s good for them, many accept to get vaccinated, knowing that increasing their own immunity will mean that they have less likelihood of contaminating someone else.

There is a harder core of anti-vaxxers and outright conspiracy theorists who won’t do the right thing, even if they know that could harm others. It should come as no surprise, then, that the only thing that appears to be working with people who only think about themselves, is to threaten to take something away from them.

It was a real eye-opener when Quebec Premier Francois Legault decided to bar the unvaccinated from liquor stores and marijauna dispensaries. Thousands went running for their first dose!

Although his salty choice of terms landed him in hot water, it was French President Emmanuel Macron who proposed the best approach. He said that he really wanted to tick-off the anti-vaxxers (his scatological term “emmerder”, literally means that he wished to cover anti-vaxxers in excrement which, if nothing else, is certainly a good way to make them stand out in a crowd!).

What Macron meant was, take away their privileges. He wasn’t talking about forced inoculation. He knows that won’t work. Macron was saying that if you want to do anything in the society that you’re part of, you’ll have to prove that you’ve done what’s necessary to protect yourself and others.

Want to wait this thing out, unvaccinated, in your basement? Go ahead. Want to go have a glass of wine at your local bistro? Forget about it, if you don’t have your vaccine passport.

Within his areas of jurisdiction, Justin Trudeau is starting to apply the Macron formula. When trucking companies started whining that they already had too few drivers and that Canada shouldn’t be checking to see if those crossing the border are vaccinated, Trudeau told them to take a hike. Get vaccinated or you and your 18-wheeled vector can stay out. Good for him!

It’s hard to believe that we’re entering our third year of the COVID-19 pandemic. Tolerance of restrictions has now been stretched as thin as the resources of our healthcare system. Governments would do well to read the mood and not hesitate to use every tool at their disposal to protect the public.

Tom Mulcair was the former leader of the federal New Democratic Party of Canada between 2012 and 2017.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Quebec to impose 'significant' financial penalty against people who refuse to get vaccinated

WEB FINALS/Joe-Lofaro_bio.jpg

Joe LofaroCTVNewsMontreal.ca Digital Reporter

@giuseppelo Contact

Published Tuesday, January 11, 2022 11:40AM ESTLast Updated Tuesday, January 11, 2022 2:35PM EST
Link to comment
Share on other sites

From the WDYTWGTH file.

Hopefully with full back pay and an apology: 

Ontario considered forcing hospitals to rehire unvaccinated staff due to surging case numbers

The difference between freedom and security is that freedom comes at a huge cost and it can only be maintained by constant vigilance.


Edited by Wolfhunter
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thousands sign up for 1st dose of COVID-19 vaccine as Quebec threatens to tax the unvaxxed

WEB FINALS/Rachel-Lau_bio.jpg

Rachel LauCTVNewsMontreal.ca Digital Reporter

@rachel_lau Contact

Published Wednesday, January 12, 2022 8:26AM ESTLast Updated Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:32AM EST
  • More than 7,000 people registered for their first dose of a COVID-19 vaccine Tuesday, amid threats by Quebec officials to tax the unvaccinated.

    "Our highest in several days," tweeted Quebec Health Minister Christian Dubé, noting that 5,000 appointments were also made on Monday. "This is encouraging."

    Dubé notes the appointments were made across all the age groups, and 107,000 doses of vaccine were administered Tuesday alone.

The same day, Quebec Premier François Legault announced the province will impose a "significant" penalty on people who refuse to be vaccinated against COVID-19 for non-medical reasons.


Legault called the measure a "health care contribution," adding that he is in consultations with his finance minister and legal advisers to determine how much the fines could be.

The premier already argued $50 or $100 "is not significant" enough for him.

The tax would apply to all adults in Quebec who refuse to get their first dose of a vaccine "in the next few weeks." People with medical exemptions will not be subject to the tax.

The unvaccinated "will have a bill to pay because there are consequences on our health care network and it's not up to all Quebecers to pay for this," Legault insisted. "It's a question of equity because right now, these people are putting a very important burden on our health care network and I think it's normal that the majority of the population is asking that there be a consequence."

Vaccination :
��Les prises de rdv pour la 1ère dose continuent d’augmenter. Environ 5K rdv ont été pris le 10 janvier et 7K hier, notre record depuis plusieurs jours. Les rdv ont été pris dans toutes les tranches d’âges.
��107K doses administrées hier

C’est encourageant!

— Christian Dubé (@cdube_sante) January 12, 2022

Last week, the province announced it would also require Quebecers to show proof of COVID-19 vaccination to access Société des alcools du Québec (SAQ) and Société québécoise du cannabis (SQDC) stores.

This new measure will come into effect on Jan. 18.

"I hope this will be an additional incentive for some to go get their first dose," Dubé said. "The vaccination passport will be extended to certain non-essential commerces in the coming weeks and we'll come back with a list after we have talked to the industries."

Tuesday, 62 more people died because of COVID-19.

There are currently 100,448 active cases in Quebec. Hospitalizations have risen to 2,742 and ICU numbers have increased to 255

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Non-vaxxers must be deterred from harming others


  • Calgary Herald
  • 12 Jan 2022
  • TASHA KHEIRIDDIN Tasha Kheiriddin is a Postmedia columnist and principal with Navigator Ltd.

What to do about the unvaccinated? As Omicron tears through Canadian society, this public health question has become a political wedge issue. The Liberals and Conservatives have chosen sides, ramped up the rhetoric, and polarized the debate, each playing to the base they think is most likely to support their point of view.

With 88 per cent of Canadians over the age of 12 fully vaccinated, the Liberals figure they're pretty safe siding with the crowd that favours the jab. Regrettably, they have chosen the strategy of demonization. On Friday, Health Minister Jean-yves Duclos speculated provincial governments would make vaccination mandatory, which he said could be needed to get “rid” of the virus. During the election campaign Prime Minister Justin Trudeau called the unvaccinated “misogynists and racists.” He dialed that down a bit last week when he said that Canadians are angry at the unvaccinated who take up hospital beds, but his remarks caused a furor that has yet to subside.

This is not accidental. The sad reality is that there is a subset of the unvaccinated who fit Trudeau's description; since September, for example, some have been using the hashtag “Pureblood” on social media to self-identify as unvaccinated. You don't have to scroll far to find tagged images peppered with shots of white supremacy gestures or MAGA hats. The Liberals' dogwhistle is designed to conflate these people with mainstream Conservatives — and turn people off Conservative Leader Erin O'toole's call for “reasonable accommodation.”

O'toole is asking for “acceptance” of the fact that up to 15 per cent of the population will not get vaccinated. He favours using rapid tests to keep unvaccinated workers on the job, as opposed to shutting down to stop the spread of the virus. “In a population that is now largely fully vaccinated, in fact the action and inaction by the Trudeau government is normalizing lockdowns and restrictions as the primary tool to fight the latest COVID-19 variant.”

But this approach is also wrong. First, it relies on unreliable technology. Rapid tests are not good at detecting Omicron infections, particularly in the early stage when a person is infectious but shows no symptoms. Second, it sends a double message. On the one hand, the Tories encourage people to “get vaccinated.” On the other, they make allowances for those who eschew the jab.

It's like saying “wear your seatbelt, but if you don't, that's OK.” Well guess what — it's not. If you get in an accident, it will cost up to three times more to treat you in hospital than if you were buckled up. Sound familiar?

The reality is that we restrict plenty of behaviours where we judge the harm to others, including economic harm, outweighs the limits to individual liberty. We don't allow people to smoke in workplaces or public buildings. We forbid drinking and driving. And we mandate vaccination for contagious diseases such as measles if children are to attend public school.

Why? Because otherwise your actions, or inaction, present a real risk of harm to someone else. They can cause quantifiable loss, in the form of sickness, suffering, even death (yes, last year 200,000 people worldwide died of measles, mostly children under five).

People don't live in a vacuum. A liberal would cite Jean-jacques Rousseau's Social Contract, which called for government by popular consent; a conservative would point to Edmund Burke, who rightly observed, “Men are never in a state of total independence of each other.” In other words, there is no freedom without responsibility, no liberty without duty.

When it comes to vaccination, we should protect those who understand this truth from those who disdain it. Vaccine passports, restrictions on interaction and withdrawal of privileges are preferable to calling people names, forcing them to get the shot, or conversely accommodating a choice that puts others in harm's way. Obliging those who opt out of vaccination to pay a penalty, such as the Quebec government is suggesting, is also a possibility. Such measures are not about cajoling or compelling, though if they do result in more vaccinations, that's a good thing. They are meant to protect all of us who just want to move on from this once-in-a-century public emergency and get back to living our lives.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

52 minutes ago, Kargokings said:

Non-vaxxers must be deterred from harming others


We should proceed with draconian measures immediately. They are such a bad idea that I fully support them now.

And fear not, I will continue to support these moronically bad ideas until those who demand them cry uncle. As with other historically foolish endeavours, it's a hurdle to be overcome en route to reasonable compromise. 

As always though, I'm surprised by the appetite for unpleasant outcomes so I'll ask again... do y'all really want what you seem to be asking for here; I don't think that you do.

Edited by Wolfhunter
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Wolfhunter said:

We should proceed with draconian measures immediately. They are such a bad idea that I fully support them now.

And fear not, I will continue to support these moronically bad ideas until those who demand them cry uncle. As with other historically foolish endeavours, it's a hurdle to be overcome en route to reasonable compromise. 

As always though, I'm surprised by the appetite for unpleasant outcomes so I'll ask again... do y'all really want what you seem to be asking for here; I don't think that you do.

Here is the link to the story so folks can perhaps get a better idea of what was posted by me, headline quoted by you and  now attributed to you using the forum quote mechanism. 🙃

Tasha Kheiriddin: The unvaccinated must be deterred from harming others | National Post

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here's a Canadian study that says, and I paraphrase, 'it won't kill you, but...'


January 12, 2022

Assessment of Functional Mobility After COVID-19 in Adults Aged 50 Years or Older in the Canadian Longitudinal Study on Aging

Key Points

Question  What is the association of a COVID-19 diagnosis and mobility and physical function among community-living middle-aged and older Canadians during the initial pandemic lockdown in 2020?

Findings  This cohort study of 24 114 participants found that community-living middle-aged and older adults with confirmed, probable, or suspected COVID-19 had nearly 2-fold higher odds of worsening mobility and physical function compared with adults without COVID-19, although most participants with COVID-19 had mild to moderate disease and were not hospitalized.

Meaning  These findings suggest that individuals with mild and moderate COVID-19 who were predominantly not hospitalized experienced deficits in functional mobility compared with those without COVID-19.



In this population-based cohort study of community-dwelling middle-aged and older adults, we found that mild to moderate COVID-19 was associated with worsening mobility and difficulties in physical functioning. In view of the large number of adults diagnosed with COVID-19 worldwide, there is a need to further understand the longer-term impacts of the illness and to consider the development and implementation of effective intervention and management approaches to address any persistent deficits in mobility and functioning among those living in the community.

Edited by deicer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here it is 12 hours after that report was released and it doesn't show up on any of the main line North American outlets. It is on a number of news networks in other parts of the world.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, GDR said:

Here it is 12 hours after that report was released

Even longer because the report was anticipated prior to release. For more aggressive governments, this could be the hardest walk back yet. They need time and the media is providing it.... different thread eh? Efficacy and sustainability limitations seem like the best tactic to me but even that will leave a mark. 

In fairness though, I can’t imagine that they ever expected to require so many boosters at such short intervals. We could easily be up to 5 or even 6 by this time next year. Surely that’s raising new questions and concerns about protein toxicity, ADE, and inflammatory / autoimmune effects. If not, it should be.

It certainly worries me and I didn’t even take it. I’ve had lots of vaccines over the years prior to extended holidays in foreign lands and never once felt worried about any of them. I would have resigned over this one though.

Edited by Wolfhunter
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So far, the announcement seems to have had little effect on humility:

WaPo columnist: It's time to make life a 'living hell' for the unvaccinated

WaPo columnist claims, 'There is no justifiable excuse for refusing vaccination.'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I hate jumping into this topic because it’s so toxic on both sides of the subject of which both sides have some validity….but….then there’s this….another 46 Ontarians to be added to the already 31,082 Canadians who have bit the dust so far.

“Ontario is reporting another jump in people hospitalized with COVID-19 Wednesday as the number of patients in intensive care surpasses 500.

Health officials said 3,448 people are now in hospital testing positive for COVID-19, which is an increase of more than 200 people in the past 24 hours.

The number of people in intensive care also jumped to 505, which is an increase over the 477 on Tuesday.

The province also reported Wednesday that 54 per cent of the hospitalizations are people who are in hospital primarily due to COVID-19, while the remaining 46 per cent were admitted for other reasons but are now testing positive for the virus.

In intensive care, 83 per cent of patients are admitted primarily for COVID-19, while the remaining 17 per cent have tested positive but are being treated for another issue.

Ontario also reported a spike in COVID-19-related deaths, logging 46 fatalities in the latest report.

Meanwhile, Ontario reported 9,782 new COVID-19 cases on Wednesday, with a test positivity rate of 20 per cent. 

Health officials have warned that due to testing restrictions, the number of cases reported daily is an underestimate of the true amount.

In the Greater Toronto Area, officials reported 1,675 new cases in Toronto, 1,060 new cases in Peel Region, 964 new cases in York Region, 819 new cases in Durham Region and 434 new cases in Halton Region.

Officials reported 471 new cases in Waterloo region and 588 new cases in Ottawa. 

Of the confirmed COVID-19 cases in Ontario today, 1,347 were in people unvaccinated, while 327 involve those who are partially vaccinated. There were 7,673 cases in people with at least two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine, and 435 in people with an unknown vaccination status.

The province reported 235 resident cases and 134 staff cases in long-term care settings across Ontario. It also noted that three of the 15 deaths reported were long-term care residents.

Officials stated that at least 389 long-term care homes are currently dealing with an outbreak of COVID-19.”


Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Create New...