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Tarmac accident at YYZ

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Probably have change of clothing in the roller  bags they took down the slides with them..

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Change of clothing,  makes sense.  

Anyone remember Bruce Hood, (former NHL referee) ?

He was appointed "Complaints Commissioner" for the travelling public around 2000 or so by the government of the day.

Seems he thought about warm clothing being a good idea when coming back from the sunny South one winter.  However he had the warmer clothing in his checked bags

and "Murphy",  with perfect timing, chose his bags to  go astray. Delicious irony I suppose.

In fairness to him though, the odds of that happening are pretty long but he sure knew where to complain to. :D

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5 minutes ago, Innuendo said:

 

Anyone remember Bruce Hood, (former NHL referee) ?

 

I ran into him while on vacation years ago in the Caribbean. Played tennis against him. It did not go well. :(

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Some interesting videos of this incident.  According to one, the Sunwing ‘37 was empty and being towed.  The WJ ‘37 isn’t on fire yet an evacuation is called.

In the video from inside the WJ ‘37, you can hear “ It’s not our airplane on fire.  REMAIN SEATED”.  I wonder if a video with “EVACUATE EVACUATE EVACUATE” will emerge...

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1 hour ago, Zan Vetter said:

Bruce Hood died today. 

Well, talk about Foot in mouth timing. 

Where is the Slap head emoji ?

 

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6 hours ago, vanishing point said:

I wonder if a video with “EVACUATE EVACUATE EVACUATE” will emerge...

Yup.

 

 

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Whoa. That’s some nasty damage to both but looks like Sunwing got the worst of it plus their machine will be out of action for awhile. Obviously the APU was running. Lucky they didn’t lose the whole plane.

Pretty harsh working conditions on the ramp these past few days. The problem is if you’re bundled up too much it’s hard to see what’s around you.

 

 

Edited by blues deville

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Listening to the audio I think there is a big ooopps moment there on the part of the apron controller....no mention of WJ being parked .

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So was there any disruption to the Sunwing schedule? Or was that particular ship overnighting anyways?

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22 minutes ago, st27 said:

Listening to the audio I think there is a big ooopps moment there on the part of the apron controller....no mention of WJ being parked .

Needless to say, a tow shouldn't push into a taxiing aircraft, even with a clearance. But this is just fallout from the overcontrol in YYZ where they tell you to pass behind aircraft that you have no chance of even being close to. If you want to control everything, you have to control everything.

What did hit me was how long it took for someone to actually call for the trucks. It was 25 seconds from when the WJ pilot indicated a fire till someone asked for fire/rescue or called a MAYDAY. 

10 hours ago, Moon The Loon said:

We've all seen several examples of how fast an external fire can propagate.

 

As a matter of fact, if there is no major fuel leakage, external fires generally don't propagate very fast.

Given that it was a wingtip impact at the end of a flight, there wouldn't be any leakage from the WJ and there wasn't any major stream of fire indicating a major leak from the Sunwing, the chances of a rapidly spreading fire are slim. The fire on the Sunwing aircraft was not streaming to the ground so was relatively contained.

Not second guessing the pilots in their decision to evacuate, but it might have been worth a few seconds more to wait till the Sunwing pulled away. The evacuation was called at 25 seconds in that video and it looks like there is separation between the aircraft at that point. There will, undoubtedly, be injuries from the evacuation. Anytime a fire is evident near an aircraft, the reflex is to get the people off the aircraft, but it is not always the best course of action, IMO.

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Does the 37 have outer wing tanks and associated fuel vents??   If so, that might have been a concern. I’m sure the WJ pilots were thinking “WTF...I can’t believe what I’m seeing!!!!” 

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It’s quite likely that the folks in the apron control cab had summoned the trucks well before the crew did it.  

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That's quite an assumption when there's a fire burning. 

Communication in this whole process was quite poor. Short "he hit us", "he's into us" is not good enough IMO. I know the quality of these tapes is not that good, but had he said "Sunwing STOP", instead of asking  Ramp Control to talk to them, we may not even be discussing this.

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I don’t recall arguing against your point on the poor communications, I only offered that there is a strong probability that the crew’s call for the trucks wasn’t the first one.

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Not sure if you can see the wingtip on a 737 but the pilots are dealing with a situation they cannot see. They are relying on information coming from cabin crew and ground controllers, attempting to asses that information and then decide on a course of action. Not an easy position to be in and, I'd imagine when (if) a call of "fire" was relayed they had to make a decision. In my view, based on what we can see and what they probably knew at the time they made a call that erred on the safe side.

 

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2 hours ago, gator said:

 

Communication in this whole process was quite poor. Short "he hit us", "he's into us" is not good enough IMO. I know the quality of these tapes is not that good, but had he said "Sunwing STOP", instead of asking  Ramp Control to talk to them, we may not even be discussing this.

One thing that you may not know about these liveatc recordings is that they are done by aviation fanboys who setup a scanner to capture and upload what is broadcast on whatever frequencies they like.  Depending on the location of the scanner, how many frequencies are being scanned, the scan rate and dwell time when finding something whole swathes of communication can be missed.  I would not take that recording as being complete or accurate.

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bad weekend at JFK also.

Planes Collide on Tarmac at JFK Amid Airport Chaos: Officials

Kuwait Airways said on Twitter that Flight 118 from New York to Kuwait was struck by the Chinese plane as it was parked before takeoff

Published at 7:33 AM EST on Jan 6, 2018 | Updated 2 hours ago, the Port Authority confirmed

  • The wing of a China Southern plane hit the tail of a Kuwait airplane

  • No injuries were reported and the passengers exited safely, the Port Authority said

Two passenger jets collided at John F. Kennedy Airport early Saturday, officials said. 

The right wing of a China Southern plane hit the tail of a Kuwait airliner, damaging both aircrafts, the Port Authority said. No one was injured and all the passengers got off safely, according to the Port Authority, which manages all three NYC-area airports. 

The China Southern flight was being towed when the planes collided shortly after midnight, the FAA said. Both planes are Boeing 777s. 

Kuwait Airways said on Twitter that Flight 118 from New York to Kuwait was struck by the Chinese plane as it was parked before takeoff. The passengers were taken to hotels as they waited for alternative flights, the airline said. 

The airline said it was working with authorities in New York to investigate. 

The China Southern plane didn't have any passengers at the time, according to the Port Authority. 

The collision follows long waits at JFK in terminals, on planes on the tarmac and waiting to get luggage the day after Thursday's blizzard shut down the airport. 

The Port Authority said a backlog of flights caused the delays. The agency was providing portable staircases and buses to deplane passengers and bring them into the terminal. 

By Saturday afternoon, the Port Authority said it was still working to limit flights coming into JFK until there were enough gates available to handle the backlog. 

Passengers complained of lengthy waits on planes and in the terminal since Friday afternoon.

"@JFKairport 3 hours on the tarmac waiting for a gate tonight. Pilot saying airport control is "chaotic". Is anyone there?," tweeted one passenger who had landed on a flight from Germany at 8 p.m.

Another on a different flight added, "Stranded in the airplane for more than 3 hours in #jfkairport waiting for a gate in the “capital of the world” with freezing temperatures outside starting to affect the cabin. This is #ridiculous." (At 3 a.m., it was 10 degrees with a wind chill of -9 at the airport.)

Another passenger, meanwhile, said that passengers began calling 911 from the plane while they waited and others began "to threaten to break open emergency exit." He also reported a fellow passenger was going through a medical episode and complained about heart conditions.

"This is illegal," he tweeted.

According to air travel tracking service Flightradar 24, dozens of planes had the same issues after landing. At midnight, it posted a screen shot of ground traffic at the airport showing what appear to be several dozen planes sitting in apparent waits for gates. 

"After landing 3.5 hours ago, #DY7019 awaits a gate. Unfortunately for passengers at JFK tonight, they have plenty of company," the service tweeted.

Later, the airline said the plane made it to a gate after 4 hours -- and after circling the entire airport. 

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