Westjet F/A in the news...

[conehead]

http://globalnews.ca/news/3503307/westjet-flight-attendant-grabs-passenger-phone-toronto-area-couple-booted-from-u-k-flight/

[Zan Vetter]

I'm with the FA....deplane, sorry. 

If you need an audience with the captain to whine about a crew member and your carry on baggage before the flight has even left, you're a hazard. 

Letting her in the FD, why? Gives me great respect for all FAs and gate agents who handle this type of preflight nonsense without involving the flight crew, other than to inform us that it is happening. To which my response is usually, "I support your decision, please let me know if it escalates."

[Guest]

Other FA News:

After pilots organize, push is on to unionize WestJet flight attendants

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A pilot taxis a Westjet Boeing 737-700 plane to a gate after arriving at Vancouver International Airport on February 3, 2014. A recent successful bid to unionize WestJet pilots has prompted a push to organize flight attendants at the airline.THE CANADIAN PRESS/Darryl Dyck

By: Ian Bickis The Canadian Press Published on Tue Jun 06 2017 02:00:00

CALGARY — A recent successful bid to unionize WestJet (TSX:WJA) pilots has prompted a push to organize flight attendants at the airline.

The airline, Canada's second-largest, has long prided itself on its relationship with its employees, whom it refers to as co-owners. Among the benefits offered to WestJet staff are a company-matched share purchase plan.

But in recent weeks, WestJet has found itself the target of two unions wanting to represent its flight attendants.

The WestJet Professional Flight Attendants Association (WPFAA) says it has ramped up efforts, while the Canadian Union of Public Employees says it's considering launching its own campaign to unionize flight attendants.

Daniel Kufuor, interim treasurer at the WPFAA, said when the airline's pilots voted last month to join the Air Line Pilots Association, International, that was a boost.

"It is seen ... as the first domino to fall," said Kufuor, a former WestJet flight attendant whose dismissal is now the subject of a wrongful termination lawsuit.

He said WPFAA has about 1,200 union cards signed and needs some 200 more to reach the 40 per cent threshold to trigger a union vote, but the numbers keep shifting as the six-month cards expire and WestJet adds flight attendants.

CUPE, which already represents about 10,000 flight attendants in Canada, most of which with Air Canada, is now also considering a new unionization campaign at WestJet after past attempts in 2006 and 2013 failed.

Hugh Pouliot, a spokesman for CUPE, said they're still in planning stages and have been in discussions with flight attendants, but haven't made a formal decision yet.

"People have been talking to us about unionizing, especially now that ALPA has unionized the pilots," said Pouliot.

When the pilots organized, CEO Gregg Saretsky said he was disappointed but added he would work with the new union.

"WestJet believes that management and employees work best together through open and direct dialogue," company spokeswoman Lauren Stewart said in an email.

"This is the hallmark of our success over 20 years."

The unionization efforts come as WestJet embarks on some of its most ambitious expansion plans since it was founded in 1996. It has set out to launch both an ultra-low cost carrier and expand internationally.

Raymond James analyst Ben Cherniavsky said such growth, as well as other initiatives such as new baggage fees and its recently established flights to London, are helping drive the push towards unionization.

Cherniavsky said the successful unionization, while not surprising, will likely result in higher costs for WestJet.

"Although it is unfair to conclude that the unionization of WestJet's pilots means that its culture is 'broken,' there is no question that labour relations have become more complicated for the company," he said in a note to clients.

The airline will continue to talk with employees as its expansion plans continue, Stewart said.

"We are focused on our expansions plans and will work with our employees to ensure they are heard as we introduce these exciting new initiatives."

[J.O.]

People who claim to be fellow passengers who witnessed the situation in the UK are coming down firmly on the side of the FA. According to them, the passenger's histrionics went on for some time before the video starts. To accommodate other passenger's carry-on bags, the FA had moved her small bag to a different OHB location nearby. Apparently that simple action was enough for the passenger to want to see the captain. Talk about needy!

[thor]

IMO... 2 choices, turn phone off, I'll talk. Keep recording, you get off. 

[blues deville]

That flight deck video chat appeared to be in a 737. Where does "UK" come into this story?

[thor]

737s fly to Glasgow and Dublin.

[Boney]

And LGW

[Tango Niner]

WestJet 737NG routes to Europe:

YYT-LGW

YYT-DUB

YHZ-GLA

[CanadaEH]

14 hours ago, J.O. said:

People who claim to be fellow passengers who witnessed the situation in the UK are coming down firmly on the side of the FA. According to them, the passenger's histrionics went on for some time before the video starts. To accommodate other passenger's carry-on bags, the FA had moved her small bag to a different OHB location nearby. Apparently that simple action was enough for the passenger to want to see the captain. Talk about needy!

I've flown on three flights where this FA was working my flights in the last two months. He's been great - friendly, caring, and professional. 

[boestar]

Pretty much every time we see one of these "incident" videos, we are not getting the whole story.  Either the video is edited with parts missing critical to the context or the recording starts after the triggering event.

I would estimate that a high percentage like 99.999999% of these incidents are incited by the passenger.  I have noticed a huge upswing in A-holes with a skewed sense of entitlement when flying.  Everyone wants the royal treatment but are unwilling to pay for it.

People disregard the FA's instructions and ignore the safety demos and generally don't give a @#$%.

You cannot go by a snippet of video that shows the poor mistreated passenger you need the whole thing showing the passenger being a Di#$.

[DEFCON]

" I have noticed a huge upswing in A-holes with a skewed sense of entitlement when flying.  Everyone wants the royal treatment but are unwilling to pay for it."

 

And pax behaviour will only get worse with the introduction of ULCC's.

 

[blues deville]

I'm curious how this became a flight deck discussion with this passenger. Who does WS use for ground handling at LGW?

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, blues deville said:

I'm curious how this became a flight deck discussion with this passenger. Who does WS use for ground handling at LGW?

Since the incident happened onboard, not sure why the ground handler would be involved or am I missing something?

[blues deville]

50 minutes ago, Malcolm said:

Since the incident happened onboard, not sure why the ground handler would be involved or am I missing something?

With an aircraft still parked at a gate I wouldn't get involved playing referee in a situation such as this. Let the ground staff handle it. And in this case probably a contract ground handling company however you usually get what you pay for when someone else manages your passengers for your airline. 

[runaway]

As soon as that F/A touched the passenger it changed the argument to probably some mediocre act of assault. I agree he should have left this disagreement in the hands of the gate staff or law enforcement.

[better4me]

23 minutes ago, runaway said:

As soon as that F/A touched the passenger it changed the argument to probably some mediocre act of assault. I agree he should have left this disagreement in the hands of the gate staff or law enforcement.

The altercation was not in the overly litigious Excited States of America, the FA will be okay and his actions were reasonable considering the pax shoved the cell phone in his face. 

[Maverick]

 

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An air passenger advocate is advising travellers who are in a heated dispute with an airline worker to pull out their phone and record the conversation.

Gabor Lukacs is offering the advice in response to a group of angry Air Canada travellers in Halifax who missed their connecting flight to Sydney earlier this month. A number of them reported hearing an Air Canada employee threaten to put them on a "no-fly list" and calling police to deal with the verbal dispute.

He said having witnesses could help if no recording was made, as was the case in the recent Halifax incident. 

• 'I was in full panic mode': How an Air Canada flight turned into a harrowing midnight drive

Lukacs took United Airlines to court for damages over a November 2007 flight from Winnipeg to Chicago that was cancelled due to mechanical failure. During the trial an airline employee alleged that Lukacs was "agitated, forceful" and that "he was yelling at her." 

Gabor Lukacs earns his living as a math professor. He helps airline passengers in his spare time and for free. (The Canadian Press)

But after Lukacs produced a voice recording of their 13-minute conversation, the worker admitted to the judge he had not yelled. The Court of Queen's Bench of Manitoba judge ruled the airline worker "exaggerated the tone and loudness of the plaintiff's words."

"In Canada, you don't need the airline's permission to record the employee or the employee's permission to record a conversation with them," Lukacs told CBC.

"That's what I have done in those two cases in Winnipeg and when the airline's employees agents were telling the court Gabor Lukacs was yelling at us, I pulled the recording and the judge found that they were not speaking the truth."

Math professor by day, activist by night

Lukacs is a math professor by profession and runs the Facebook group Air Passenger Rights as a public service after he had one too many run-ins with terrible airline service. 

The Halifax man has also had airlines call the police on him, so he was not surprised to learn the Air Canada official in Halifax did the same thing when faced with stranded passengers. 

"This is just wrong. [The job of] police is to deal with illegal activities," Lukacs said. "Those passengers did nothing wrong. They were just tired, stranded, polite and peaceful. So why call the police on them?"

He pointed out that the passengers had a right to be upset, as they were stuck in Halifax because the Air Canada flight left without them.

He said the "no-fly list" threat made by the same Air Canada employee was exaggerated. "He has no power to prevent someone from flying within Canada. It's a government list," he said. "Although some people unfortunately have ended up on Air Canada's no-fly list just because they had some dispute with the crew."

Air Canada should take responsibility

He said the no-fly lists should be used for people who smoke in the airplane toilet or harass passengers or crew, not travellers just trying to get home. Airlines should have clear guidelines for when employees should call police, he said. 

CBC News asked Air Canada if they had such a policy, and if the Halifax official was using it correctly when he called the police to deal with the peaceful passengers. Air Canada refused to answer either question. 

"We should be pointing the finger at the corporation that puts him in that situation," he said. 

He said airlines can help by better training employees and giving them tools to properly handle situations.

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/nova-scotia/air-canada-gabor-lukacs-passengers-rights-1.3916212

[Canoehead]

Gabor should stick to his day job.  He gets far too much attention IMO.

[FA@AC]

2 hours ago, Canoehead said:

Gabor should stick to his day job.

Would he only!  Anyone who finds it necessary to go around filming every interaction they have is clearly better suited to dealing with numbers than with people.

[Newman]

19 hours ago, Maverick said:

"[The job of] police is to deal with illegal activities," Lukacs said.

Although dealing with illegal activities takes up a big part of police resources, they are also focused on crime prevention and maintaining order among other things.  A big part of achieving that is simply being present to keep people from doing stupid things.  You see them at all sorts of legal activities including peaceful protests, concerts, sports events, etc...  Airports are no different particularly when you can have large groups of people (ie. cancelled flight) egg each other on when things aren't going as planned, which these days can be something as small as a 15 minute flight delay for a safety issue.  I've proactively engaged airport police to be in a specific place at a specific time as a preventative measure many times.  They're always happy to do it as it's easier for them to do that as opposed to have to arrest someone who snapped because the last flight of the day went mechanical and they did something stupid because they were tired and frustrated.