deicer Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Back from 2015, but still impressive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Good work there! Just a technical discussion point, but considering the rather turbulent conditions, is it possible to define the approach as 'stable'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thor Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 Looks like a lot of overcomtroling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 44 minutes ago, thor said: Looks like a lot of overcomtroling Can't argue with success and based on the wind factor I think he / she did a good job. I think "we" have all pretty well done the same thing at one time or another.....the difference is , we didn't see how our approach and landing looked from the "outside". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon The Loon Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 Did an approach like that into KLAS about 20 years ago. At night. RW04 (??). No approach lights. Visual approach only. Can still feel the tingling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydee Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 Reminds me of Torbay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 3 hours ago, Moon The Loon said: Did an approach like that into KLAS about 20 years ago. At night. RW04 (??). No approach lights. Visual approach only. Can still feel the tingling! Why would you do that? Sounds like a hero move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 Whenever the dreaded go-around was looking possible, I almost always noted a substantial increase in crew pucker factor, especially in the sim, but even to this day I don't understand why? Yes, ego, fuel burn, operational considerations and the cost to the corporation are ever present in the pilot's mind during what is, a high velocity, 3D, real time event, but I don't think they mean all that much after you pass the FAF. The real question seems to be; why will an experienced pilot abandon the principals of a 'stable' approach at the last moment and attempt to salvage what is clearly a high risk landing, it just doesn't make sense? Is there a real, but undeserved fear of the go-around, or are we all really cowboys at heart and instinctively prone to acquiesce to favour ego at the last minute as the challenge to 'get er down' presents itself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 I think the reason is that everyone has seen a G/A go bad. Usually it's just in the sim, sometimes in real life but pilots know what that can look like and sometimes it just seems easier to try for the landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blues deville Posted April 28, 2017 Share Posted April 28, 2017 4 hours ago, DEFCON said: Whenever the dreaded go-around was looking possible, I almost always noted a substantial increase in crew pucker factor, especially in the sim, but even to this day I don't understand why? Yes, ego, fuel burn, operational considerations and the cost to the corporation are ever present in the pilot's mind during what is, a high velocity, 3D, real time event, but I don't think they mean all that much after you pass the FAF. The real question seems to be; why will an experienced pilot abandon the principals of a 'stable' approach at the last moment and attempt to salvage what is clearly a high risk landing, it just doesn't make sense? Is there a real, but undeserved fear of the go-around, or are we all really cowboys at heart and instinctively prone to acquiesce to favour ego at the last minute as the challenge to 'get er down' presents itself? I don't think it's fear or being a cowboy. I think it a mission completion mentality. Have you ever worked with a pilot who doesn't try to find a solution to a problem. Probably not very often. Same with AME's. If an airplanes got a defect they're on it. And regarding pilots, if you can't see the runway it's a clear decision. No debate. Anything else is still a challenge. However there's an old NASCAR phrase "sometimes you just run out of skill". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2017 Share Posted April 28, 2017 Not walking, this was more like stomping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker Posted April 28, 2017 Share Posted April 28, 2017 Nobody slept through that one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted April 28, 2017 Share Posted April 28, 2017 Is it me or was that a real terrible cross wind landing....look at the smoke and windsock... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon The Loon Posted April 29, 2017 Share Posted April 29, 2017 On 4/27/2017 at 2:33 PM, seeker said: Why would you do that? Sounds like a hero move. I was an F/O on that flight. The Capt. was confident in our every move. I don`t do `hero`. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEFCON Posted April 29, 2017 Share Posted April 29, 2017 Look at the smoke / steam coming from the industrial stack up ahead and to the right; the x-wind is from the left and the aircraft's nose is pointed downwind during the impact. Add to that the observation that the aircraft barely made the threshold following a steep and apparently high rate of decent. It's only a guess, but the approach appears to have become 'dangerously' unstable long before the arrival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blues deville Posted May 1, 2017 Share Posted May 1, 2017 No need to have de-crabbed but a flare at around 30' would have been a good idea. That left inboard flap section took real hit. Along with the rest of the airframe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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