Shootings and Knifings


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5 hours ago, Marshall said:

I wonder what weapon was used:

Prior to this I was always concerned about that too.... then I'd stress over whether the idiot doing the shooting was licensed and if the weapon was registered. I don't think any of that matters anymore.

This is a political battle and all that matters is having the votes. Public education and facts simply won't win the day. Canadian Liberals are much smarter than US Democrats and far more tactical in their approach. The concept of "saying it loud and saying it over and over until they totally belief it" has merit.

If you look at the statistical gathering methodology, it's brilliant. Children are 24 years of age and younger, domestically sourced weapons include those domestically registered, those lost by police services across the country, and all of the ones smuggled from the US which are untraceable due to no serial numbers. And, when using stats, they only compare 2017 with 2013 (the two most extreme years on record) because it yields the steepest curve and highest percentage increases. 

Gang members in Toronto are laughing at all this. And in truth, it is a bit funny, albeit in a sad and socially telling way. 

 

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No doubt building on the success that Toronto has achieved with disbanding TAVIS. Consultations continue and the results speak for themselves.... city council is pleased with the progress to date.

Magic 94.9 Web Poll Do you think banning handguns in Canada would curb gun violence? Yes     (1.23%)

Been there done that and the t-shirt still fits. What’s wrong with gun club members in good standing, and with appropriate ID, transporting a hand gun (restricted weapon) to and from the range without

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Local radio is reporting 3 people stabbed.  
 

And from the trivia file.....the RCMP is maintaining a high profile in the 1000 Islands ..lots of presence on the water with their RIB stopping boats randomly ...also seeing a notable presence around town in their somewhat dated Crown Vic!!! ( last produced in 2011 ).

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1 hour ago, Wolfhunter said:

Good video, thanks.

I don't know why people can't see this for what it is.

One other point that I've been making to those who I can talk to about this is the virtue-signalling aspect of it.

The "assault-style" categorization in particular.

People who are unfamiliar with firearms almost always believe that the AR15 represents the pinnacle of firepower and that by eliminating them at least everything that remains is less threatening. So I generally start with a little history and fact (I flush out the detail in conversation but here will just gives the high points);

- WW1, WW2 (and typical hunting rifles) and calibers were and are significantly more powerful and effective at longer ranges.

- Soldiers were reluctant to use the capability of these rifles but were saddled with the weight of them and the weight of the cartridges.

- The AR15 is less powerful and has shorter range but has the benefit of being lighter and has lighter ammunition.

- The AR15 balances the power and range capability with the "normal" range at which they would be used. Would you buy a Corvette to drive to the grocery store?  Nope, you'd get a little SUV.  The AR15 is the Honda CRV of the gun world.

- In the sport-shooting world the AR15 is common because it's cheaper to buy ammunition for and because it's customizable.  (Short discussion about why an AR15 looks the way it does, what all those little cutouts are for, why the ridges, why no-wood).

 - Short discussion about why mass shootings (in the USA) almost always involve an AR15; cheaper to buy, more available.  The patent ran out in 1977 so any company (100s) now make them.

- Then, if I have a internet device with me I show this: https://www.browning.com/products/firearms/rifles/bar/current-production/bar-mark-3.html

 - The Browning Bar, classic wood stock hunting rifle (not banned, far more powerful than any AR15).  Generally most people (except rabid anti-hunters) have no problem with a wood stock hunting rifle. 

- OK, now look at this: https://www.browning.com/products/firearms/rifles/bar/current-production/bar-mk3-stalker.html  It's the exact same rifle (yeah, I know it's not exactly the same).  Usually, people don't like the look of this one as much because it's black and has no-wood.  Then I ask them to imagine it with the buttstock and forestock replaced with the AR15 buttstock and forestock.  It would look almost exactly like the AR15, while actually being much more powerful and is not banned because it's a hunting rifle.

- Around this point most people are starting to understand it's more about appearance than anything to do with the rifle itself.  To really drive the point home, look at this:

Ruger 10/22: https://www.ruger.com/products/1022Sporter/specSheets/1102.html  not banned. 

S&W MP15-22: https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-15-22-sport  banned because it looks like an AR15

And, one more to drive the point home: https://www.sportsmans.com/shooting-gear-gun-supplies/rifles/ruger-1022-tactical-semi-auto-rifle/p/1503508

Identical in capability but it's all about the appearance.

 

Edited by seeker
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33 minutes ago, seeker said:

Soldiers were reluctant to use the capability of these rifles

Not this guy. Most 031s old enough to remember the FN (C1&2) were, and still are, big fans....the ladies not so much as being 7.62 it had more kick... first round hits out to 600 meters with the aperture sight was standard fare on the small arms instructor course  

By way of trivia though, the C1 never earned the mantle of "assault rifle" since it lacked selective fire. It was considered a "battle rifle" as a result.... that wouldn't deter JT though. Changing the definitions was all part of the manipulation.

Those who say there is no definition of an assault rifle haven't looked hard enough, they are likely the ones who consider 24 year old gang members to be children as well. If you ever hear someone quoting stats from 2017 and comparing it to 2013, don't even bother with logic.... you have already lost the argument and are wasting your time. 

Barbie was right, say it loud and repeat it over and over.... they will totally believe it.

 

Edited by Wolfhunter
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12 minutes ago, Wolfhunter said:

Not this guy. Most 031s old enough to remember the FN (C1&2) were, and still are, big fans...

 

I was in the reserves and enjoyed my time with the FN.  My point was more about WW1 and WW2 and rifles from that era.  I seem to recall reading somewhere that Lee-Enfields were considered acceptable at 4 MOA while the FN was a 1 MOA.

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More mis-information being imparted.....”a weapon designed to kill the most in the least amount of time” leading people to believe these rifles are fully automatic....they can be but not legal (already) in Canada, limited to semi auto function.
What is the difference between a semi auto rifle or a semi auto handgun??

 

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15 minutes ago, st27 said:


What is the difference between a semi auto rifle or a semi auto handgun??

 

OOO, OOO,  pick me, pick me!  One's bigger!

Seriously though, semi-auto rifle (bigger than a .22) limited to 5 cartridges, handgun limited to 10.  That's the short answer, if you want the long answer let me know.

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My point, somewhat obtuse perhaps, is that the rate of fire is dependant on the action of the trigger, not the type of weapon. So, banning the Ar type does not mean you will solve the “problem”of mass shootings in Canada wrt the number of bullets that can be fired in a short period of time.

Which  highlights another problem with the governments position....they haven’t/won’t divulge what type of weapon was used ....22 people were killed but not in the typical “mass” murder. They were killed individually over the course of 15 or so hours. He could have used a .22 or a handgun for all we know....that info hasn’t been released....the government is scapegoating the issue...and wasn’t it the liberal minority that didn’t want parliament to sit so their actions couldn’t be debated?

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12 hours ago, st27 said:

they haven’t/won’t divulge what type of weapon was used .

I wonder if (I even bet) that he got his hands on the RCMP C8 from the trunk of the "real" police car. 

The liberals have been very carful to count the hundreds of lost and stolen police weapons as "domestically sourced crime guns" and this fits with the release of information to date. As predicted, there has been no mention of the weapon(s) he used because it would run counter to the narrative they are pushing and make the argument in favour of the OIC look foolish. By the time this information comes out, it simply won't matter anymore. They will scream "deflection" at anyone using fact and logic.

It's a clever ploy used to full advantage in the Danforth shooting as well.... with the full cooperation of the Toronto Police Service BTW. 

Like any good Liberal, these guys are masters at doing everything they accused Harper of doing and they are doing it using the most devious of manipulations and with the full support of their base. IMO, selective morality it's why politics is so divisive now... there is no debate centred on cause, effect, and solution, only narrative and the manipulation of facts that support it and the suppression of facts that don't. 

Only that small percentage of people familiar with the laws and the facts, I'l call them activists (for lack of a better word) on either side of this issue see this for what it is. That's why gun control activists feel betrayed here.

 

Edited by Wolfhunter
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Is this what the General public sees as an assault weapon?  This is now a banned  weapon according to the new law.  I mean REALLY????

No photo description available.

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20 hours ago, Wolfhunter said:

Not this guy. Most 031s old enough to remember the FN (C1&2) were, and still are, big fans....the ladies not so much as being 7.62 it had more kick... first round hits out to 600 meters with the aperture sight was standard fare on the small arms instructor course  

By way of trivia though, the C1 never earned the mantle of "assault rifle" since it lacked selective fire. It was considered a "battle rifle" as a result.... that wouldn't deter JT though. Changing the definitions was all part of the manipulation.

Those who say there is no definition of an assault rifle haven't looked hard enough, they are likely the ones who consider 24 year old gang members to be children as well. If you ever hear someone quoting stats from 2017 and comparing it to 2013, don't even bother with logic.... you have already lost the argument and are wasting your time. 

Barbie was right, say it loud and repeat it over and over.... they will totally believe it.

 

you could make the C1 an automatic with a matchbook cover.  Hence it is a prohibited weapon.

 

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13 hours ago, st27 said:

My point, somewhat obtuse perhaps, is that the rate of fire is dependant on the action of the trigger, not the type of weapon. So, banning the Ar type does not mean you will solve the “problem”of mass shootings in Canada wrt the number of bullets that can be fired in a short period of time.

Which  highlights another problem with the governments position....they haven’t/won’t divulge what type of weapon was used ....22 people were killed but not in the typical “mass” murder. They were killed individually over the course of 15 or so hours. He could have used a .22 or a handgun for all we know....that info hasn’t been released....the government is scapegoating the issue...and wasn’t it the liberal minority that didn’t want parliament to sit so their actions couldn’t be debated?

I have witnessed sport shooters empty a clip of a semi auto weapon faster than a fully auto with better accuracy.  So it ALL depends on who has it shouldered.

 

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1 hour ago, Wolfhunter said:

I wonder if (I even bet) that he got his hands on the RCMP C8 from the trunk of the "real" police car. 

The liberals have been very carful to count the hundreds of lost and stolen police weapons as "domestically sourced crime guns" and this fits with the release of information to date. As predicted, there has been no mention of the weapon(s) he used because it would run counter to the narrative they are pushing and make the argument in favour of the OIC look foolish. By the time this information comes out, it simply won't matter anymore. They will scream "deflection" at anyone using fact and logic.

It's a clever ploy used to full advantage in the Danforth shooting as well.... with the full cooperation of the Toronto Police Service BTW. 

Like any good Liberal, these guys are masters at doing everything they accused Harper of doing and they are doing it using the most devious of manipulations and with the full support of their base. IMO, selective morality it's why politics is so divisive now... there is no debate centred on cause, effect, and solution, only narrative and the manipulation of facts that support it and the suppression of facts that don't. 

Only that small percentage of people familiar with the laws and the facts, I'l call them activists (for lack of a better word) on either side of this issue see this for what it is. That's why gun control activists feel betrayed here.

 

I makes no difference what colour your lawn sign is.  They only argue because the other guys did it.  If it is them its fine.  All Parties will screw the citizens at some point in their tenure.

 

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59 minutes ago, boestar said:

Is this what the General public sees as an assault weapon?  This is now a banned  weapon according to the new law.  I mean REALLY????

No photo description available.

I do not think this is banned.  Why do you think it is?

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7 hours ago, boestar said:

I makes no difference what colour your lawn sign is

I understand your point.

As a side bar issue though, we know that he took her 9mm and mags. No mention of the RCMP C8 but there are some suggestions of an "assault rifle" in play.

If the lawn sign on the 9mm was in the form of a horse it does make a difference and explains a lot, total transparency on all aspects of everything, full disclosure contained in daily briefings... everything in focused detail except the weapons used.

Surely it's simply an omission, an inadvertent oversight, right?

If it turns out he used RCMP weapons (9mm and/orC8) in any of the offences I predict it will be a long time before that information is made known. In fact it will be deliberately suppressed for as long as possible and PMO finger prints will be all over it. The reason why is pretty obvious....

Now, contrast the current situation with the release of information that would have occurred if he was licensed and the weapons he used were registered. WE WOULD KNOW WHAT HE HAD FOR LUNCH ON THE RPAL COURSE BY NOW. And knowledgeable people on both sides of the issue know it.

Perhaps that's the real point that's gone unnoticed here... knowledgeable people on both sides of the issue know it's a political sham and both feel betrayed. Often that might stand as the definition of compromise, here it's only the definition of political agenda.

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14 hours ago, seeker said:

I do not think this is banned.  Why do you think it is?

because it is capable of producing a shell energy of 10,000 joules or more.  It is a big game hunting rifle.  Now illegal.

 

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1 hour ago, boestar said:

because it is capable of producing a shell energy of 10,000 joules or more.  It is a big game hunting rifle.  Now illegal.

 

Gotcha, I thought I was looking at an old double-barrel shotgun instead of an old double-barrel rifle.  I can understand why it was banned.  Those things are dangerous - if you're an elephant or a Cape Buffalo!

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US family 'murdered shop guard for enforcing mask policy'

Calvin MunerlynImage copyrightGOFUNDME Image captionCalvin Munerlyn was shot dead on Friday

A woman has been charged along with her husband and son with killing a security guard who refused her daughter entry to a shop because she was not wearing a face covering.

Calvin Munerlyn, 43, was shot in the back of the head on Friday at the Family Dollar store in Flint, Michigan, one of the US states hardest hit by the pandemic.

He was attacked after telling 45-year-old Sharmel Teague's daughter she could not come into the shop without a state-mandated mask.

The mother's husband, Larry Teague, 44, and son, Ramonyea Bishop, 23, are accused of going to the store shortly afterwards and fatally attacking Mr Munerlyn.

Sharmel Teague has been arrested, but the two other suspects remain at large. All three face first-degree premeditated murder and firearms charges.

Larry Teague is also charged with violating the governor's order requiring face coverings inside stores in order to prevent coronavirus transmission.

Her daughter has not been charged.

Larry Teague, Sharmel Teague, Ramonyea BishopImage copyrightGENESEE COUNTY PROSECUTOR’S OFFICE Image captionLarry Teague (l), Sharmel Teague (c) and Ramonyea Bishop (r) face murder charges

After the initial verbal altercation at the store, Genesee County Prosecutor David Leyton told a news conference on Monday, Sharmel Teague shouted at and spat on Mr Munerlyn before driving away in a red GMC Envoy.

She returned a short while later with her son and husband before the fatal confrontation ensued, according to officials.

It was the son who allegedly pulled the trigger.

The prosecutor told reporters: "The death of Calvin Munerlyn is senseless and tragic, and those responsible will be held accountable to the fullest extent of the law."Mr Munerlyn's mother, Bernadett, told the Associated Press news agency: "All my baby was doing was his job."A GoFundMe page set up for Mr Munerlyn's funeral has raised nearly $100,000 (£80,000). According to the page, he leaves behind eight children.

Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer has ordered all residents in the Midwestern state to wear face coverings when inside business premises in order to fight Covid-19. Stores can refuse service to anyone who does not comply with this rule.

As of Monday the number of confirmed coronavirus cases in Michigan stood at 43,950, including 4,135 deaths, state officials said.

Last week, hundreds of protesters, some of them armed, converged on the statehouse in Lansing and demanded an end to the governor's stay-at-home order.

There has been angry resistance elsewhere in the US to rules imposed to deter the virus' spread.

An order that went into effect on Friday in an Oklahoma town requiring the use of face masks in business premises was rescinded within hours amid a furious backlash from customers.

Store employees in Stillwater reported threats of violence, including one involving a gun. Mayor Will Joyce swiftly amended the order to strongly encourage, but not mandate, the wearing of face masks.

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On 5/3/2020 at 8:05 AM, Wolfhunter said:

Not this guy. Most 031s old enough to remember the FN (C1&2) were, and still are, big fans....the ladies not so much as being 7.62 it had more kick... first round hits out to 600 meters with the aperture sight was standard fare on the small arms instructor course  

 

 

I still have my "Best Shot FNC2" trophy.

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Preaching to the choir here, but surprised to see this opinion piece in the Globe and Mail giving a critical look at Trudeau’s latest attempt at gun control :

Quote

So if you’ve been cheering Ottawa’s new gun “prohibition” as the end of the legal sale of military-conceived deadly weapons … well, I’m sorry to tell you this, but you’ve been had. Meticulously misleading government messaging will do that......

He called this a ban on “military-style assault rifles.”

But that’s a designation that has no meaning in Canadian law under the Firearms Act. It is, rather, a made-up, undefined category, useful only in perpetuating the mistaken impression that Canada has banned a whole classification of firearms when it has not.

Again, Canada has not banned semi-automatic weapons. Instead, it has banned nine principal models and their variants, essentially expanding the list of prohibited weapons by roughly 1,500 models. Yet there are still plenty of other semi-automatic weapons – such as the military-style IWI Tavor, which looks just as scary as those newly prohibited – that remain perfectly legal.

Mr. Trudeau and his ministers skirted this inconvenient detail by sticking closely to their line about banning “military-grade assault weapons.” The more accurate way to describe what the government did is to say that it arbitrarily prohibited the sale of some semi-automatics, while preserving the status of others. Yet the government knows the misleading messaging is far more rousing than the precise kind. Already, the announcement has earned the applause of celebrities and American progressive politicians.

Indeed, the government trusts that those to whom this gesture is supposed to appeal won’t really know the difference. That’s why Mr. Trudeau could say last Friday that “you don’t need an AR-15 to bring down a deer," even though hunters in Canada already weren’t allowed to use an AR-15 (or other restricted firearms) to do so. It’s also why he could talk about banning “guns designed to kill the largest number of people in the shortest amount of time” in reference to semi-automatic weapons, although he was actually describing fully automatic weapons, which were banned decades ago.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-canadas-gun-ban-is-not-what-the-government-says-it-is/

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3 hours ago, st27 said:

Preaching to the choir here, but surprised to see this opinion piece in the Globe and Mail giving a critical look at Trudeau’s latest attempt at gun control :

People on both sides of this are beginning to appreciate how clever it is.... not in practical terms where it gets a failing grade on all counts, but politically.

It's a huge wedge issue and the Conservative party will look very bad, in places they can ill afford to look bad (Toronto and Quebec), by opposing it. Most voters simply don't  see this for what it is... the fact that it utterly fails from an efficacy perspective doesn't really matter to anyone who doesn't understand the complexities.... they see a problem and they want it fixed. 

Only when you look at this from their perspective do you see the manipulative genius here and the challenge it presents to the Conservatives. They will need to become more devious and manipulative themselves in the days ahead. I'm thinking that this will become a key election issue that will be easy to sell to vote rich areas.

The Liberals will push the notion that Conservatives will dismantle the "effective controls" in place and that Canadians will be less safe as a result. And here is the beauty, the fact this fixes a non-existent problem will be presented as proof their approach works. In case anyone is wondering, that's exactly why they are afraid of the handgun issue and want to offload it. I have often said that they will invoke the violence against women angle.... it's finally here now too.

I fear our Conservatives share a few negative traits with US Democrats, they underestimate their opponents, over estimate their own abilities, fail to anticipate traps and simply aren't as tactically minded as they perceive themselves to be. Harper was always on top of this stuff...

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