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In these old eyes... Trump Disagree with   4      Agree with 10

                                  Biden Disagree with 10     Agree with 4


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This is all I will say on the subject. Let's be honest, they didn't exactly have an easy choice. Liar vs. Liar is a pretty accurate way to frame it. They made their choice but were deeply divided in d

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2 hours ago, deicer said:

For screwing an intern and lying about it.

Unlike trump who is screwing the American people and lying about it.


Oh I see, so if your side lies, it is OK. But if the politicians you don't like lie, its terrible. This is why you are a hypocrite and a fraud. And a mindless statement about Trump supposedly screwing the American people with no example. I could say the same about Obama screwing the American people or Clinton. It is mindless.

By the way, it was Michael Flynn's conviction for lying that started this little sub-discussion. Now you change it to Trump.

But you seem so concerned about lying. As if it is a reason not to vote for somebody. Yet you wish Hillary Clinton were president. Watch this video of direct Hillary Clinton lies:

 But we know you ignore Hillary's lies, because you are a fraud, who pretends to care about lying but only when convenient.



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2 hours ago, deicer said:

Well maybe when you are negotiating agreements, going to summits, dealing with the press, making supreme court nominations, fighting an impeachment, working on the economy, etc, etc. you might forget something. It is a little more complex than remembering if that Airbus wanted type II or type IV.

But seeing as forgetting(or perhaps lying) about something and then using forgetfulness as an excuse is such a terrible thing for you, How do you justify in your mind that Hillary(who you wish was president) said more than three dozen times that she couldn't remember when being interviewed by the FBI for her crimes:

Oh yeah, and she though the large C on her classified emails were some sort of alphabetical filing system even though all classified memos appeared t o be a C and no other letters were used.

You are a fraud de-icer.

Why don't you just try having a discussion based on policy. Worried that people will reject it en masse.

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You missed posting while you were away 🤣

Hilary Lost!

Bill is part of history.

What you fail to acknowledge is that that trump and the gop are doing now far exceeds getting blown.  

And Flynn was convicted because he was lying for trump.  He's just another piece of the puzzle.

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Ginsburg Supreme Court: Republicans secure vote for replacement

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Republicans have secured the numbers needed to ensure that President Trump's Supreme Court nominee will face a confirmation vote in the Senate.

Senator Mitt Romney of Utah has given the party the 51 votes needed to move forward with voting on Mr Trump's candidate to replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg, who died on Friday.

The move ensures a bitter political battle.

Democrats argued there should be no confirmation in an election year.

President Trump says he will announce his nominee on Saturday

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52 minutes ago, deicer said:

You missed posting while you were away 🤣

Hilary Lost!

Bill is part of history.

What you fail to acknowledge is that that trump and the gop are doing now far exceeds getting blown.  

And Flynn was convicted because he was lying for trump.  He's just another piece of the puzzle.

Yes, we know Hillary lost and Bill is history. But you support them and their policies and were happy to have Bill in power and would have been happy to have Hillary in power even though they lie a lot as well. 

In other words, your supposed concern about Trumps lies are just pretend concern. You are happy to have your liar in power but pretend that somehow lying is an important issue for you when someone else is in power. 

Why don't you just be honest yourself and tell us the real reason why you think Trump shouldn't be re-elected instead of pretending it is about lies or that lies are a significant issue. Both sides lie. Case closed.


By the way, there is documented evidence that the FBI intentionally had a plan to get Flynn to lie. The police creating the conditions for a crime instead of investigating one. That is a dangerous thing.

I suppose if you continue on with the Trump team lying, I could go back and find stuff during the Obama admin to prove you a fraud again.

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It really won't matter if Trump loses in November. With the changes made to the Supreme Court in favour of "sanity" over "feelings", the days of the Socialist Left will have been halted for quite some time. 

By doing so Trump really did MAGA.


Mitt Romney says he'll support moving forward with Supreme Court pick

Sen. Mitt Romney (R-Utah) announced Tuesday that he would support moving forward with a Senate vote on President Trump's selection to replace the late Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg.

Why it matters: Barring any big surprises, Democrats have virtually no shot at stopping the confirmation process for the president’s nominee before November’s election.

The big picture: Romney was one of the few Republican senators who were question marks amid Trump's push to quickly nominate a replacement for Ginsburg. Earlier this year, Romney was the sole Republican who voted to convict Trump for abuse of power after the impeachment trial.

Republican Sens. Susan Collins (Maine) and Lisa Murkowski (Alaska) have both said they oppose voting before the election.

What he's saying: "The historical precedent of election year nominations is that the Senate generally does not confirm an opposing party’s nominee but does confirm a nominee of its own," Romney said in a statement.

“The Constitution gives the president the power to nominate and the Senate the authority to provide advice and consent on Supreme Court nominees."

"Accordingly, I intend to follow the Constitution and precedent in considering the president’s nominee. If the nominee reaches the Senate floor, I intend to vote based upon their qualifications.”

Driving the news: Romney declined to say at a press gaggle whether he would support voting for Ginsburg's replacement in the lame-duck congressional session between November and January if Biden wins the presidency.

Context: Republicans in 2016 opposed confirming President Obama's Supreme Court nominee, Merrick Garland, because it was an election year and control of the government was divided between the GOP and Democrats. Romney said in the press gaggle that he did not believe the Garland decision was "unfair," arguing that it was "consistent with precedent."

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The ‘Trump train’: 'I'm tired of people putting down our president'

By Tara McKelveySterling, Virginia
  • 22 September 2020
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Vehicles drive along the roadImage copyrightGETTY IMAGES

Some Trump supporters in Democratic-leaning districts of Virginia, Wisconsin and other states say they feel maligned because of their conservative views. They are now banding together in convoys for solidarity. Here is what a ride on the "Trump train" looks like - and what it means for the nation.

Scott Pio coasts through a neighbourhood in northern Virginia on a recent Sunday in his Jeep, a Wrangler draped in Trump flags. He waves at two women dressed in tank tops who are chatting in a front yard. They give him a hard stare.

Pio, a 36-year-old software engineer, is hardly surprised.

On weekends the president frequently comes here to play golf at his club, Trump National, and progressive activists gather in front of its entrance to protest his policies. Here in this Democratic-leaning part of Virginia, a Trump supporter like Pio (pronounced PIE-oh), gets a chilly reception.

One of the Democratic activists who congregates at the entrance to the president's club, Juli Briskman, became famous several years ago for making an obscene gesture at the presidential motorcade. She is now an elected county official, a position that she owes in part to her newfound celebrity-dom.

Pio heard about Briskman when he moved to the area about a year ago. Now he leads a convoy made of flag-draped motorcycles, Jeeps and big-wheelers that drives up and down on the street in front of golf club. The "Trump train", as it is also known, acts as a counterbalance to the actions of Briskman and the Democratic protestors.

"I'm tired of people putting down our president," says Pio, explaining why he decided to organise the convoy. "And I'm tired of the disrespect."


Pio likes the president's efforts at deregulation - removing restrictions on businesses - and his immigration policies, especially the US-Mexico border wall.

"He's a builder, not a politician," he says.

There are similar pro-Trump convoys across the US.

The processions roll along highways and dusty trails in liberal enclaves such as Sterling; Eau Claire, Wisconsin; and McAllen, Texas. In many of the towns, the people in the convoys may not see the president's motorcade, as they do in Sterling. Yet they are still demonstrating their support loudly and clearly.

For many people, the idea of Trump 2020 flags on trucks evokes harrowing images from Portland last month when Trump supporters in a caravan clashed with liberals. On that day one supporter, Aaron Danielson, was shot and killed. The convoys that take place in Sterling and other cities have been peaceful, though.


The people in the convoys are united both by their affection for the president and also by their own feeling of being marginalised within their communities.

The processions are driven by those who describe themselves as the president's base. As a demographic group, the president's base are white men and women who earn relatively high salaries but are less likely to have a college degree than Democratic voters, according to a study.

Many of these conservatives believe Democratic elites "look down on them because they're more religious and they're interested in guns", says Stephen Norwood, a history professor at University of Oklahoma in Norman, adding: "There's a lot of resentment that they've been overlooked."

Says Norwood: "They see Trump, and he's able to convince them that he's contemptuous of the elites."

Trump complains about how badly he is treated in Washington and celebrates his base, the "forgotten man and the forgotten women".

His poll numbers are falling, though, and his supporters worry about his fate and their own.


"These guys kind of feel their economic and political birthright slipping away," says Jefferson Cowie, a history professor at Vanderbilt University in Nashville. "So they're screaming."

Or they're ringing a cow bell: Roger Cole, 64, a home-improvement contractor, clanged one on a recent Sunday.

He was standing next to his big rig, a 1980 model with a Trump flag, that had broken down ("power-steering issues") across from the president's golf club. Cole was momentarily out of action, and he was showing his support for the convoy with the bell.


The convoy, like many others across the US, formed spontaneously and without the help of Trump campaign officials.: "It was 100% organic," explains Pio, the organiser of the Virginia convoy.

Says 32-year-old Clare Krenzelok, a mother of four in Chippewa Falls, Wisconsin, who organised a 500-strong convoy in her state: "This was completely a movement of the people."

The vehicular processions have grown over time. The Virginia convoy has jumped from 30 people in the early summer to "168 patriots", says Pio. They do not all show up every weekend, but they come when they can.


The convoys build solidarity among the Trump supporters, a group of people who describe themselves as "the common man".

One of them, Lee Jackson Shockey, 73, was sitting behind the wheel of a pick-up truck on a recent Sunday. He says Trump understands them in a way that few political leaders do.

The son of a hog farmer, Shockey grew up in Virginia and works as an accountant. "Lots of times I hear President Trump on TV, and I think: 'Damn. I would've said that.'"

A hunter who was raised around firearms, he says he likes the way that the president stands up for the Second Amendment, which protects a right to gun ownership.

And Shockey believes the president has been good for the economy, that he has "streamlined a lot of these regulations that strangled businesses".

On the Sterling convoy, some vehicles have signs that say: "Trump National Rapid Response Team". They head down Lowes Island Boulevard, a road that was carved into a hill not far from the Potomac River, and drive past the entrance to the president's golf club.


One of the truckers, Mike Taylor, 62, a retired fire marshal in a '79 Kenworth, says that Trump stands up for the country and its workers: "He stopped taking second- or third seat to other countries, specifically China."

Standing on a sidewalk only yards away, progressive activists stage their own demonstration. They grip banners that denounce the president as a "Democracy Killer" and wear T-shirts emblazoned with the names of Joe Biden, the Democratic presidential nominee, and his running mate, Kamala Harris.

Juli Briskman, 53, the elected country official, still comes regularly to the event. Speaking on the phone, she says that she holds a banner in front of the golf club that says: "Lock him up". She says that the place where she lives, Loudoun County, once a Republican district, is now mostly Democratic.


She reflects on the way that the Trump supporters now band together in convoys in the neighbourhood to express their views. "It might be painful to be told that your views are outdated," she says. "Their reactions are the feelings of white fragility."

One of the progressives at the event, Meagan Donahue, 49, stood on the side of the road in a Biden-Harris shirt and watched the Trump convoy roar past. "You see these, like, semis with these flags," she says, referring to the trucks on the convoy. "They are like a cult."

The mood on the street is tense. Some of the Trump supporters shout at the progressive activists and call them names ("Losers!"). Sometimes, says Pio, the progressive activists throw water bottles at the drivers in the convoy. "Full ones," he says.

He palms a mud-splattered steering wheel, heading past the president's club, while an American flag on the side of the jeep flaps in the wind.

The flag blocks the flying debris, he says: "The flag does protect me." It is secured with knots he learned as an Eagle Scout while growing up in Florida. Knot-tying, it turns out, is a useful skill for a convoy leader.

In a nearby parking lot, the air smells of pine needles and hand sanitiser, and people shout over the roar of four-cylinder engines. Pio tells them to keep an eye on their blue-and-red pro-Trump signs. "We've got to protect them," he says explaining that the progressive activists sometimes tear them down: "They threw them in the trees last time."

In the afternoon, the president leaves the club, and people start to head home.

Reflecting on the event, Pio seems pleased: "It was perfect." He walks along the side of the road, picking up signs. The election outcome and the fate of the president and his base is unclear. In the meantime, Pio plans for the next weekend and another convoy.


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I said I would not look at this post again, but here I am. 🙂

its really striking to me to see extreme views. And it seems to be getting worse. I suppose it has to do with an election coming. And the fact that I never paid attention before.

Seems clear to me (at this point) that the US institution and how they've set up their government is heavy. 

It also seems to me that the democrats appear to be loosing their sanity. I've researched both candidates and their accomplishments. I'm leaning towards the Republicans as they seem the least corrupt. But I'm sure the left wing and the right wing belong to the same bird.

But there is something disturbing about societies that are okay with this type of stuff?



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23 minutes ago, Amelia said:

I said I would not look at this post again, but here I am. 🙂

its really striking to me to see extreme views. And it seems to be getting worse. I suppose it has to do with an election coming. And the fact that I never paid attention before.


Extreme viewpoint is what we FREE humans are all about.  If it wasn't we would be living in "The Brave New World" where everyone was bred, educated to hold the same reliefs and POV.

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On 8/20/2020 at 1:24 PM, deicer said:

One for the 'Birds of a Feather' file.

Seems trump's acolytes follow in his footsteps.

NEW YORK -- Former White House adviser Steve Bannon was arrested Thursday on charges that he and three others ripped off donors to an online fundraising scheme “We Build The Wall.”



Geez, one might thing that De-icer is suggesting that Trump is not worthy of being president because one of his former officials was arrested and charged with a crime. Therefore, one shoulf vote for the Democrats. Wait a minute. What does that headline say:

"Obama White House counsel Greg Craig charged with lying to prosecutors about foreign lobbying"

I guess De-Icer is just a fraud who pretends to be outraged when something bad happens in Trump White Hoise but ignores the Obama White house stuff.

Hmmm, wasn't de-icer outraged that Michael Flynn pleaded guilty to lying to investigators. Kind of the same as this Greg Craig guy.


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3 hours ago, Amelia said:

I said I would not look at this post again, but here I am. 🙂

its really striking to me to see extreme views. And it seems to be getting worse. I suppose it has to do with an election coming. And the fact that I never paid attention before.

Seems clear to me (at this point) that the US institution and how they've set up their government is heavy. 

It also seems to me that the democrats appear to be loosing their sanity. I've researched both candidates and their accomplishments. I'm leaning towards the Republicans as they seem the least corrupt. But I'm sure the left wing and the right wing belong to the same bird.

But there is something disturbing about societies that are okay with this type of stuff?



Just watched this documentary tonight, I think it explains quite well why society is where it's at.


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On 9/1/2020 at 9:19 AM, deicer said:


President Trump thinks that protesters want to “overthrow the American Revolution” and that the National Guard and regular military must act decisively to “dominate the streets.” Black Lives Matter activists worry that these protests, like so many over the last few decades, will eventually subside, leaving temporary concessions, symbolic victories and an unaltered regime of systemic racism, along with unabated police violence.

History shows us that Trump has some reason for fear—not of an actual rebellion, but of a revolution that could overturn the racism that still pervades American society. 


Here is the reality of BLM. Admitted Marxists, which De-icer supports. Come on De-icer, be honest. Would you like to see an end to capitalism and is a violent revolution something that is worthwhile to achieve that goal. Give us your deep down personal feelings without cover to try and look good.

"Black Lives Matter co-founder Patrisse Cullors said in a newly surfaced video from 2015 that she and her fellow organizers are “trained Marxists” – making clear their movement’s ideological foundation, according to a report.

Cullors, 36, was the protégé of Eric Mann, former agitator of the Weather Underground domestic terror organization, and spent years absorbing the Marxist-Leninist ideology that shaped her worldview, Breitbart News reported.

“The first thing, I think, is that we actually do have an ideological frame. Myself and Alicia in particular are trained organizers,” she said, referring to BLM co-founder Alicia Garza.

“We are trained Marxists. We are super-versed on, sort of, ideological theories. And I think that what we really tried to do is build a movement that could be utilized by many, many black folk,” Cullors added in the interview with Jared Ball of The Real News Network."


P.S. Sorry, no time to watch the long video you posted just prior to this one.

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4 hours ago, JDunkin said:

P.S. Sorry, no time to watch the long video you posted just prior to this one.


Likely would have been a waste of time.  Here is evidently what the show is about:


Plot: What's the story about?

The Social Dilemma is a powerful exploration of the disproportionate impact that a relatively small number of engineers in Silicon Valley have over the way we think, act, and live our lives. The film deftly tackles an underlying cause of our viral conspiracy theories, teenage mental health issues, rampant misinformation and political polarization, and makes these issues visceral, understandable, and urgent.


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21 minutes ago, Marshall said:

The film deftly tackles an underlying cause of our viral conspiracy theories, teenage mental health issues, rampant misinformation and political polarization, and makes these issues visceral, understandable, and urgent.

So I guess they are referring to a) The MSM namely CNN, NYT, CBC, Toronto Star

                                                     b) Facebook, Google, Twitter, censorship ?

                                                     c) The Democrats, / Liberals ?


                                                     d) Deicers posting history ? :Clever:


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On 8/21/2020 at 7:54 AM, deicer said:

And here's the link to the actual report.


Spanning 966 pages, it concluded, as have other assessments of Russia's efforts, that Moscow "engaged in an aggressive, multifaceted effort to influence, or attempt to influence, the outcome of the 2016 presidential election." 

The report, redacted in parts, detailed extensive contacts between Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Konstantin Kilimnik, a Russian national who worked closely with Manafort for years. The report labeled Kilimnik a "Russian intelligence officer," and said Manafort, for reasons the committee could not determine, sought on numerous occasions to "secretly share internal Campaign information with Kilimnik." It also said the committee obtained "some information" linking Kilimnik to Russian intelligence services' efforts to hack and leak information to damage Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party. 



Senate Intelligence Committee releases final report on 2016 Russian interference




Here is the real collusion with Russia in 2016. From Wikipedia:

"From April 2016 through October 2016, the law firm Perkins Coie, on behalf of the Hillary Clinton 2016 presidential campaign and the Democratic National Committee, retained Fusion GPS to continue opposition research on Trump.[28][29][30] In June 2016, Fusion GPS retained Christopher Steele, a private British corporate intelligence investigator and former MI-6 agent, to research any Russian connections to Trump. Steele produced a 35-page series of uncorroborated memos from June to December 2016, which became the document known as the Donald Trump–Russia dossier."

Steele(a who stated he was desperate to keep Trump out of power) got his info from the Russians including the so-salacious accusations with the prostitutes in Moscow. Steele and the Dems no doubt knew that this was false and there was NO evidence to back it up. The Dems using Russian lies to smear Trump.


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8 hours ago, deicer said:

11 days, 40 posts, almost all attacking me.

Sounds healthy.

Welcome back!

Hmmm, I wonder how many posts you have on this thread. I tell you what, why don't you show where you think I have posted incorrect or erroneous or hypocritical information, which is exactly what I have been doing for your posts.

I will admit though that you have now energized me to search further back through what you have posted here in order to ensure any misleading info is counteracted.

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On 8/12/2020 at 10:42 AM, deicer said:

Oh  the irony is delicious...



It is interesting but actually quite normal for businesses entities to donate to both sides of the political spectrum in order to further their interests. The nice thing is that he has been quite open about it but is rich enough that he isn't bought off.

"Donald Trump bragged Thursday night that he could buy politicians — even the ones sharing the stage with him at a Republican presidential debate.

Trump was asked about something he said in a previous interview: “When you give, they do whatever the hell you want them to do.”

“You’d better believe it,” Trump said. “If I ask them, if I need them, you know, most of the people on this stage I’ve given to, just so you understand, a lot of money.”

The only complaints came from two candidates who yelled that they had received no Trump money. As Trump continued to talk, he was interrupted by Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla., complaining that Trump instead gave campaign contributions to Rubio’s Democratic opponent.

“I hope you will give to me,” said Gov. John Kasich of Ohio.

“Sounds good. Sounds good to me, governor,” said Trump.

Without missing a beat, the real estate tycoon continued: “I was a businessman. I give to everybody. When they call, I give. And you know what? When I need something from them, two years later, three years later, I call them, and they are there for me.” He added, “And that’s a broken system.”

Repeatedly asked what he got in return for his donations, Trump said: “With Hillary Clinton, I said be at my wedding and she came to my wedding. You know why? She didn’t have a choice because I gave. I gave to a foundation that, frankly, that foundation is supposed to do good.”

Though it surely wasn’t his intention, Trump was illustrating the key problem with the current campaign finance system. Campaign contributions are legally considered bribes only when there is an explicit quid-pro-quo. But as Trump explained, giving money to politicians bought him access and relationships, which he could leverage down the road in the form of favors. Such conflicts of interest are inherent in privately funded election systems.

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1 hour ago, deicer said:

Thank you for posting something that confirms what I posted.

Correct, the person that you think would have been the better president does what the donors want. Now, shall we talk about the Russian donations of millions of dollars to the Clinton foundation and her support for Russia gaining control of uranium in America.

"As secretary of state, Clinton did serve on a government board that ultimately approved a transfer of uranium, but she wasn’t the deciding vote. And the Clinton Foundation did receive $145 million from parties involved in the transaction..."

Imagine the outrage from the left if this exact scenario happened with Trump. But instead, no interest. Because they are frauds who pretend to care that someone like Trump donated to Harris's campaign and therefore is not voteworthy.


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Your Politifact article says that allegation is false. So what's the point?

Our ruling

A Facebook post claims that Hillary Clinton transferred uranium to Russia in exchange for donations to the Clinton Foundation. It also says Robert Mueller was involved.

The claim makes it seem like Clinton bears responsibility for the deal when a panel of several departments and agencies were part of its approval.

And while the connections between the Clinton Foundation and the Russian deal may appear fishy, there is no proof of any quid pro quo.

As for Mueller, the ties are even more specious.

We rate this claim Mostly False.


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Further to that, there is this backgrounder on it:

Clinton told a New Hampshire TV station in June 2015 that "I was not personally involved because that wasn’t something the secretary of state did." And Jose Fernandez, who served as assistant secretary of state for economic, energy and business affairs under Clinton and represented the department on the panel, told the Times that Clinton "never intervened with me on any CFIUS matter."

But even if you don’t take either Clinton or Fernandez at their word, the reality is that the State Department was just one of nine government agencies that signed off on the transaction.

Second, while we concluded that nine people related to the company did at some point donate to the Clinton Foundation, we found that the bulk of the $145 million came from Giustra. Guistra said he sold all of his stakes in Uranium One in the fall of 2007, "at least 18 months before Hillary Clinton became secretary of state" and three years before the Russian deal.

We couldn’t independently verify Giustra’s claim, but if he is telling the truth, the donation amount to the Clinton Foundation from confirmed Uranium One investors drops from more than $145 million to $4 million.

The main exception is Ian Telfer, an investor who the New York Times found donated between $1.3 million and $5.6 million to the Clinton Foundation during and after the review process for the Russian deal.

So while Trump was within his right to question links between foundation donors and their ties to Uranium one, his specific charge was exaggerated.

Meanwhile, the Washington Post Fact Checker subsequently looked at a similar Trump statement: "Remember that Hillary Clinton gave Russia 20 percent of American uranium and, you know, she was paid a fortune. You know, they got a tremendous amount of money."

The Fact Checker came to the same conclusion about Trump’s misleading language, giving Trump’s assertion its worst rating of Four Pinocchios.

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