Headscarf row: Air France lets crew skip new Tehran route

[Lakelad]

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Air France headscarf row: Airline lets crew skip new Tehran route

Many female crew members were unhappy with the ruling, Air France said

Mon Apr 04, 2016 -  BBC News  

Air France is willing to let female crew members opt out of flying a new route to Tehran after they were asked to wear a headscarf on their arrival.

The airline will restart its flights to the Iranian capital on 17 April.

Management last week circulated a note asking female staff to wear trousers on the route and put on a headscarf when they left the plane.

Union officials said some staff members were concerned about the ruling and had asked Air France bosses to relax it.

Ahead of a meeting with a number of unions on Monday afternoon, Gilles Gateau, Air France's human resources director, told the Europe 1 channel he was willing to offer a compromise.

"We're going to present them with an opt-out clause for any female employee affected on the Paris-Tehran route," he said. "If, for personal reasons, they don't want to wear the headscarf when they leave the plane, they would be reassigned to another destination."

Mr Gateau said the company "had heard from a number of women, be they air hostesses or pilots, who said following this rule would be a problem for them".

Flore Arrighi, of the cabin crew union Unac, said before the meeting it was crucial that staff who opted out of flying to Tehran were not sanctioned by Air France.

Over the weekend, the company pointed out that the rule had also applied on its routes to Saudi Arabia which, like Iran, expects women to wear the headscarf in public.

Air France also said the requirement had been in place on the Tehran route before it was suspended in 2008.

It was reinstated after a warming in ties last year between world powers and Iran in exchange for it curtailing its nuclear programme.

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[Guest]

My rule was always, when visiting another country, to abide by their rules ,  as I would want them to do when vising my country. 

Whatever happened to "When in Rome, do what the Romans do"?

[Fido]

I would bet that the flight attendant union thought that people could bid the route and then stay home while getting paid for it.

[Kip Powick]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

My rule was always, when visiting another country, to abide by their rules ,  as I would want them to do when vising my country. 

Whatever happened to "When in Rome, do what the Romans do"?

I don't even want to go there........

[Airband]

1 hour ago, Malcolm said:

Whatever happened to "When in Rome, do what the Romans do"?

Submit? Grovel?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Airband said:

Submit? Grovel?

Airband, we get really **bleep** off when folks come to Canada but don't want to abide by our way of life etc, so why the hell should we feel that we can go to their Country and impose our way of life? Recent history shows what happens when a more powerfull nation imposes their version of democracy on a nation that has never had such a system. Change has to come from within and not be imposed from without. Nothing however wrong with helping to support a majority that wants change.

[Airband]

Malcolm, do you really think we should do as the Romans did?

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Airband said:

Malcolm, do you really think we should do as the Romans did?

Airband.  I am surprised you would ask. It is an old saying that to paraphrase comes down to "while in another country that you should abide by their standards while being there as a guest!!! It is indeed ignorant to think you can behave according to your standards in their country. 

[Airband]

By the links provided, it appears the Romans buy into it.

[Innuendo]

Did France not ban wearing the Niquab while out in public to have people conform to their "Standards/culture",  call it what you like?

So can Iran not also ask those from outside their country to observe their "Standards/Culture" etc. ?

[Wolfhunter]

All of which tends to reinforce my view that head coverings are “imposed” on women as a function of culture and tradition. The quran only requires modest dress.  

 

Using the opposite extreme by way of illustration, if the culture and tradition of Canada was the mini-skirt, would anyone insist Egypt Air FAs conform?

[deicer]

Much like anyone can visit the Vatican, yet non-believers aren't even allowed to enter the city of Mecca.

[anonymous]

Go to HAV - Havana and all the women working at the airport are in skirts and fishnet stockings...try to enforce that dress code in North America

[DEFCON]

"I don't even want to go there"

I will.

Innuendo and others are making valid observations and comments I think.

I'd like to see the corporate response if all the women of Air France were to take a stand in support of and respect for not only their own Rights, but those of women everywhere by refusing travel to any of these so-called nations.

In these circumstances, the corporations of the West are letting the cavemen of the world know that 'we' are willing to push the 'show of respect' for medieval policies forward, policies that are only intended to denigrate women. In accommodating the corporate request, French women are indicating their open wiliness and acceptance of a female's subservient relationship to men.

If Western business and political leaders along with individual women are all eager to look the other way when it comes to pesky little things like Equal Rights for women by acquiescing to Islamic sensibilities in the name of profit and adventure, then it would be quite unreasonable, even illogical, to expect 'visitors' from the Islamic world to behave responsibly and respectfully towards women in our own Countries?

An explanation has been provided now, I call it an excuse, for the disgusting sexual assaults being committed by the Islamic invaders against the women of Europe; apparently, the Islamic rules of life advise that women that don't cover their hair are sluts in need and out looking to be raped.

 

[Maverick]

2 hours ago, anonymous said:

Go to HAV - Havana and all the women working at the airport are in skirts and fishnet stockings...try to enforce that dress code in North America

I've travelled (biked) extensively all through Cuba, It's not just Havana, Cuban ladies dress very, very well. It may be considered provocative by our Norte Americano standard but certainly not in Cuba.

 

I found that I approved!  

 

[moeman]

3 hours ago, anonymous said:

Go to HAV - Havana and all the women working at the airport are in skirts and fishnet stockings...try to enforce that dress code in North America

Favourite place to get the post security "pat down".

[Fido]

I have done some work in Iran and there was one woman on our team.

It was not that big of a deal.  She wore a headscarf much the same as Canadian Catholic women used to wear (maybe they still do) and a very light raincoat sort of garment.

There were times that the Iranian women that worked with us were dressed more 'provocatively' than she was.  You could tell the politics of a young lady by how far back on their head they pushed the headscarf.

[Guest]

59 minutes ago, Fido said:

I have done some work in Iran and there was one woman on our team.

It was not that big of a deal.  She wore a headscarf much the same as Canadian Catholic women used to wear (maybe they still do) and a very light raincoat sort of garment.

There were times that the Iranian women that worked with us were dressed more 'provocatively' than she was.  You could tell the politics of a young lady by how far back on their head they pushed the headscarf.

And of course here in Alberta (and I guess other parts of the country) the Hutterite women wear heads scarfs and they are not exactly new comers.  http://www.hutterites.org/the-leut/dress/ 

[DEFCON]

Are Hutterite women beaten into submitting to their owners, I mean male relations?

Do the Hutterites stone their women for alleged adultery, or for being raped?

False equivalencies cannot be used imho to justify looking the other way.

I don't know that it's possible to compare anything religious that goes on in the modern day western world to the dogma, doctrine, Sharia and practices Islam subjects its followers to, not to mention any of the unfortunate infidels that find themselves within striking range?

 

 

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, DEFCON said:

Are Hutterite women beaten into submitting to their owners, I mean male relations?

Do the Hutterites stone their women for alleged adultery, or for being raped?

False equivalencies cannot be used imho to justify looking the other way.

I don't know that it's possible to compare anything religious that goes on in the modern day western world to the dogma, doctrine, Sharia and practices Islam subjects its followers to, not to mention any of the unfortunate infidels that find themselves within striking range?

 

 

 

It is my understanding from folks who have lived in the areas where women wear a headscarf, that most are not beaten into wearing them, the hijab (headscarf) is evidently a cultural item / accessory like any other item of clothing,   unlike the more restrictive niqab (face veil) and  burqa . Regarding your other questions, not all muslims behave so to their wives, sisters, women. There are however other cultures that do and again not all.

Look up honour killing for example, do we blame all or as we should go after those who continue to commit that crime.?

Here is an article on the subject: It is dated 2011 but I suspect little has changed since that time:

http://news.nationalpost.com/full-comment/barbara-kay-a-westerners-guide-to-understanding-honour-killings

A quote from the article: Today, however, we must deal with the unpleasant reality that honour killing has virtually disappeared in the West, but remains a problem amongst Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs and Christians in South Asia. Globally, the overwhelming number of honour-motivated crimes are a feature of Muslim countries, sometimes entrenched in law. Article 340 of Jordan’s criminal code stipulates that “a husband or close blood relative who kills a woman caught in a situation highly suspicious of adultery will be totally exempt from sentence.” Not “demonstrating” adultery, note, but only “highly suspicious.”

[Fido]

Iranian men that I know claim that the mother is the ruler of the family.

[Wolfhunter]

2 hours ago, Malcolm said:

It is my understanding from folks who have lived in the areas where women wear a headscarf, that most are not beaten into wearing them,

 

I would suggest to you (and your sources) that they are very often pressured into it. I would also suggest that those French FAs are being pressured a bit too. As you know, this sort of thing happens here too... we could likely start a thread about the pressures (to conform) facing young women in North America. 

 

[Fido]

32 minutes ago, Wolfhunter said:

I would suggest to you (and your sources) that they are very often pressured into it.

and I have spoken with women in the Middle East who claim that throwing on a Hijab on a Saturday morning meant that she did not need to do hair and make-up just to go to the corner store.

[FA@AC]

22 minutes ago, Fido said:

and I have spoken with women in the Middle East who claim that throwing on a Hijab on a Saturday morning meant that she did not need to do hair and make-up just to go to the corner store.

A woman in Iran who drives to the corner store without throwing her headscarf on will be fined and is likely to have her vehicle seized. 

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, FA@AC said:

A woman in Iran who drives to the corner store without throwing her headscarf on will be fined and is likely to have her vehicle seized. 

Though I guess we can say that Iran is moderate unlike Saudi where she would not be allowed to drive at all.