Thebean Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Good ole Bean, can't start a reply without running the WJ flag up and saluting it...too funny !!! :biggrin1: The point is it's not for a lack of cash that WJ hasn't introduced a harness system to ensure that the dozens of cello-carrying guests they carry on a daily basis are taken care of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebean Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 I'm not a marketing guru, but I suspect this "new & improved" Westjet motto will have an adverse effect of that pot of cash. Quite a change from the "carantee" days!I tend to agree with you, with the exception of the word "adverse", and so do others.......As a shareholder, I want to see a enough cash to run the business, (and not all the cash solely from advance bookings). I want to see the balance reinvested to generate additional returns, or returned to shareholders in the form of dividends.As it happens, WJ is doing both. So much the better. From ScotiaBank Equity Research this morning.... WJA is our top pick for 2013. Implications■ Room for consensus to move up in 2013 and beyond. We are currentlyabove consensus on our earnings view for WJA and we believe that ournumbers are sufficiently conservative as they are based on 83% LF,which is flat YOY and yield growth of 2.6%. In our opinion, yieldgrowth could outperform expectations based on various growthinitiatives that WJA has outlined.■ Longer term, we believe that WJA's growth initiatives - premiumeconomy, tiered pricing, and Encore - could easily be worth $5 pershare. The first two will start to impact numbers over the next 12-18months (management estimate is at $30M-$50M in 2013) while Encoreis more likely to come in after that. We believe that a lot of this upsideis still to be factored into numbers.■ In our opinion, the major challenge for WJA is to successfully managesuch a significant change in its focus and brand over the next few years.No doubt there will likely be hiccups but management strength anddepth allays most of our fears. Recommendation■ We believe WJA shares present a compelling opportunity at this timebased on the likelihood of earnings upside on the back of growthinitiatives, a solid balance sheet, and reasonable valuation of 4.3xEV/2013 EBITDAR, which is below its US LCC comps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boestar Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Keep in mind that this Guys Gibson was worth about $10,000. I have a neighbout that play the Viola for the philharmonic Orchestra that is worth a Quarter of a Million. A Prefessional Violin can be worth beyond $3 million. Cellos can be worh anything from a few Grand to well over 3 million. Would you trust a $3million cello to a baggage handler. These instruments are their livleyhoods not just instrumnets. If the airline wont book them a seat they wont use that airline PERIOD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebean Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Keep in mind that this Guys Gibson was worth about $10,000. I have a neighbout that play the Viola for the philharmonic Orchestra that is worth a Quarter of a Million. A Prefessional Violin can be worth beyond $3 million. Cellos can be worh anything from a few Grand to well over 3 million. Would you trust a $3million cello to a baggage handler. These instruments are their livleyhoods not just instrumnets. If the airline wont book them a seat they wont use that airline PERIOD.I completely agree. But at the end of the day, we're talking about a very, very, VERY small proportion of customers with a HUGE potential liability who are paying fares no better than what the airline would get by simply selling the seats to regular customers with a knap sack.It's all about balancing revenue and risk. Some airlines may have made the business decision that the risk is not worth the reward.Even Kelleher apparently personally wrote to a troublesome passenger cordially inviting her to use the competition the next time.If I made my living off a $3m cello, I'd spend $5,000 to have a ballistic custom built case manufactured for me, insure the carp out of it and ship it Fed Ex.But that's me. I like to control my destiny instead of having it controlled by someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I completely agree. But at the end of the day, we're talking about a very, very, VERY small proportion of customers with a HUGE potential liability who are paying fares no better than what the airline would get buy simply selling the seats to regular customer with a knap sack.It's all about balancing revenue and risk. Some airlines may have made the business decision that the risk is not worth the reward.Even Kelleher apparently personally wrote to a troublesome passenger cordially inviting her to use the competition the next time.If I made my living off a $3m cello, I'd spend $5,000 to have a ballistic custom built case manufactured for me, insure the carp out of it and ship it fed ex.BBut that's me. Yes, that's you...where do you see the HUGE potential liability?? How many instruments have been damaged when placed in a seat beside or across from the owner and tied down like many, many airlines do. I really don't think WJ has a fear of carrying tied down instruments, contained in their case, in the cabin.I think WJ got caught with their pants down because they had not run into this situation before, and/or were ignorant of the fact that the vast majority of airlines do allow these ventures.The liability issue is merely a "saving face" excuse put out as a PR for the airline.PS....Many years ago I had a WJ rep call me because they had never run into a 'guest' who wanted scuba gear carried as sports equipment free. I briefed the individual and shortly thereafter WJ added scuba gear to their "free" baggage allowance schedule, however times have changed and now WJ charges for scuba gear......but I assume there is no charge if the WJ flight is a chartered/subbed vacation pkg flight...cause no one else does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chockalicious Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Yes, that's you...where do you see the HUGE potential liability?? How many instruments have been damaged when placed in a seat beside or across from the owner and tied down like many, many airlines do. I really don't think WJ has a fear of carrying tied down instruments, contained in their case, in the cabin.I think WJ got caught with their pants down because they had not run into this situation before, and/or were ignorant of the fact that the vast majority of airlines do allow these ventures.The liability issue is merely a "saving face" excuse put out as a PR for the airline.PS....Many years ago I had a WJ rep call me because they had never run into a 'guest' who wanted scuba gear carried as sports equipment free. I briefed the individual and shortly thereafter WJ added scuba gear to their "free" baggage allowance schedule, however times have changed and now WJ charges for scuba gear......but I assume there is no charge if the WJ flight is a chartered/subbed vacation pkg flight...cause no one else does Well you are wrong. As Bean stated, simply not worth the hassle as was stated by the WS spokesperson. The liability issue you seem focussed on was only mentioned, as noted, by a CSA who was out of his depth, not as WS policy.Your recollection of the scuba gear is quite funny as I remember the folks who were dealing with it and who contacted who and the manner in which they were dealt with was very GUEST oriented even if it was undeserved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AME Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I completely agree. But at the end of the day, we're talking about a very, very, VERY small proportion of customers with a HUGE potential liability who are paying fares no better than what the airline would get by simply selling the seats to regular customers with a knap sack.It's all about balancing revenue and risk. Some airlines may have made the business decision that the risk is not worth the reward.Even Kelleher apparently personally wrote to a troublesome passenger cordially inviting her to use the competition the next time.If I made my living off a $3m cello, I'd spend $5,000 to have a ballistic custom built case manufactured for me, insure the carp out of it and ship it Fed Ex.But that's me. I like to control my destiny instead of having it controlled by someone else. Question With the AA code share how do you handle a service sold by AA on WestJet equipment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Well you are wrong. As Bean stated, simply not worth the hassle as was stated by the WS spokesperson. The liability issue you seem focussed on was only mentioned, as noted, by a CSA who was out of his depth, not as WS policy.Your recollection of the scuba gear is quite funny as I remember the folks who were dealing with it and who contacted who and the manner in which they were dealt with was very GUEST oriented even if it was undeserved.Chocky ...let us not get into a urinating contest here but it was here, on this forum, where Bean initiated the liability issue and to whom I was replying...look at my quote of his posting...Scuba gear ?? not sure where you are going with your remarks and why would my comments be funny as that is EXACTLY what happened at my end, and I have no idea why you precipitated the "guest oriented" comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chockalicious Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 @KiperooI think you are misreading the liability issue with Bean and trying to make it into something it is not. As per the WS spokesperson WS does not transport in Cabin and it simply seems that it is not worth the trouble to do so.Knowing who was involved I have a differing recollection of the scuba events, that is all and the manner it was dealt with was very guest oriented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 @Kiperoo .............................................................................................................................Knowing who was involved I have a differing recollection of the scuba events, that is all and the manner it was dealt with was very guest oriented.Still confused and after a fruitless search, I have ascertained that my emails to WJ concerning "what should be considered as scuba" gear must have been deleted...so I can not back up my 'recollections'.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeker Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Still confused and after a fruitless search, I have ascertained that my emails to WJ concerning "what should be considered as scuba" gear must have been deleted...so I can not back up my 'recollections'..Come on Kip, you've been around long enough to know the end of this story, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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