UpperDeck Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 CJOB News has learned the Doer government is negotiating with Air Canada to save 700 maintenance jobs here in Winnipeg. The subsidiary of Air Canada does maintenance work for the airline, and 100 other customers. The airline is expected to transfer the work to a newly-purchased firm in El Salvador, where labour costs are cheaper. QUOTE (Mitch Cronin @ Jan 25 2007, 10:50 AM) Good golly! Cheap labour eh? That's what happens when freakin' bean counters are left to run the railroad... But hang on a second... this railroad is run without tracks to guide us??? and the trains fly!?? Oh my.... cheap labour is going to do our heavy maintenance? Bloody fools! I really don't want to see how much more this idiocy will cost! If it winds up costing as much as I fear, I just hope the ship is loaded with the same batch of myopic bean counters. I predict any airplane we get a hold of that's come from "cheap labour" will get a very thorough and detailed examination before it flies again! The first hint of anything amiss and we'll have all the justification we need to look as deep as we like at everything that cheap labour touched... imagine that cost mr. bean counter! ...wow.... Mr. Cronin. Do you always run around your house shouting, "The sky is falling, the sky is falling!" ? I hope not. The story is complete, 100%, unadulterated prairie cow manure. It is baseless (okay, I called a contact and they have no idea where this is coming from except that it is probably speculation fuelled by a general insecurity since ACE's Aeroman purchase, which is about expanding ACTS, not shifting jobs out of Canada). They must have trucked that manure right out of some farmer's pasture. And you have partaken of it. Perhaps ACE should thank you because if enough chickens run around with their heads cut off, there will be much (needless) insecurity in the ranks come 2009. A recantation from you for your stupid rant might be in order. And then, Dagger said; You assumption is that the jobs are going to be exported to El Salvador. I don't presume anything. Right now, AC has some work done in Hong Kong anyway, but at least if it went to an ACTS subsidiary it would be more profitable and remaining ACTS employees would have a better future. Continuing: Really, smarten up. If you are worried about outsourcing, perhaps you should look at policy decisions that impoverish the Canadian economy and make it more likely. The Canadian worker doesn't have any entitlement or we'd still be making a good living out of carving buggy whips. Get over the past. Change happens. But as you can see from your peers at Westjet, if you approach things differently, if you are open to new ideas, you can enjoy a very good standard of living instead of whining over a world that has gone for good. The above was taken from an earlier thread. Mitch bemoaned what appeared to be the transfer of aircraft maintenance to El Salvador. He was berated by Dagger for being a "Chicken Little". ACTS has been sold ( a majority interest) to investment bankers and apparently, operations are being shifted to El Salvador to reduce costs. I'm not trying to pillory anyone but I do think that one should be held to account when they appear to belittle someone for no other purpose than to advance a hidden agenda. Clearly, the concerns of Mitch were legitimate and just as clearly, the trivialization of his remarks was intended to divert discussion. When that ceased to be a viable option, any commentator who criticized the transfer of work and jobs was demeaned for a diminished sense of reality; "smarten up!" Recently, Dagger and The Bean engaged in an exchange ( a Mutt and Jeff routine) about the financial prospects of Porter. It was like a PR-orchestrated exchange the intent of which was solely to diminish and potentially harm Porter. Surely the purpose of this forum is not to offer corporate interests an avenue for the use of shills to attack the competitors of their employers (or clients). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 How many folks are employed at our maintenance facility in Winnipeg? Would losing the 700 jobs effectively shut it down, or would it still remain open to satisfy the ACPPA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebean Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 CJOB News has learned the Doer government is negotiating with Air Canada to save 700 maintenance jobs here in Winnipeg. The subsidiary of Air Canada does maintenance work for the airline, and 100 other customers. The airline is expected to transfer the work to a newly-purchased firm in El Salvador, where labour costs are cheaper. QUOTE (Mitch Cronin @ Jan 25 2007, 10:50 AM) Good golly! Cheap labour eh? That's what happens when freakin' bean counters are left to run the railroad... But hang on a second... this railroad is run without tracks to guide us??? and the trains fly!?? Oh my.... cheap labour is going to do our heavy maintenance? Bloody fools! I really don't want to see how much more this idiocy will cost! If it winds up costing as much as I fear, I just hope the ship is loaded with the same batch of myopic bean counters. I predict any airplane we get a hold of that's come from "cheap labour" will get a very thorough and detailed examination before it flies again! The first hint of anything amiss and we'll have all the justification we need to look as deep as we like at everything that cheap labour touched... imagine that cost mr. bean counter! ...wow.... Mr. Cronin. Do you always run around your house shouting, "The sky is falling, the sky is falling!" ? I hope not. The story is complete, 100%, unadulterated prairie cow manure. It is baseless (okay, I called a contact and they have no idea where this is coming from except that it is probably speculation fuelled by a general insecurity since ACE's Aeroman purchase, which is about expanding ACTS, not shifting jobs out of Canada). They must have trucked that manure right out of some farmer's pasture. And you have partaken of it. Perhaps ACE should thank you because if enough chickens run around with their heads cut off, there will be much (needless) insecurity in the ranks come 2009. A recantation from you for your stupid rant might be in order. And then, Dagger said; You assumption is that the jobs are going to be exported to El Salvador. I don't presume anything. Right now, AC has some work done in Hong Kong anyway, but at least if it went to an ACTS subsidiary it would be more profitable and remaining ACTS employees would have a better future. Continuing: Really, smarten up. If you are worried about outsourcing, perhaps you should look at policy decisions that impoverish the Canadian economy and make it more likely. The Canadian worker doesn't have any entitlement or we'd still be making a good living out of carving buggy whips. Get over the past. Change happens. But as you can see from your peers at Westjet, if you approach things differently, if you are open to new ideas, you can enjoy a very good standard of living instead of whining over a world that has gone for good. The above was taken from an earlier thread. Mitch bemoaned what appeared to be the transfer of aircraft maintenance to El Salvador. He was berated by Dagger for being a "Chicken Little". ACTS has been sold ( a majority interest) to investment bankers and apparently, operations are being shifted to El Salvador to reduce costs. I'm not trying to pillory anyone but I do think that one should be held to account when they appear to belittle someone for no other purpose than to advance a hidden agenda. Clearly, the concerns of Mitch were legitimate and just as clearly, the trivialization of his remarks was intended to divert discussion. When that ceased to be a viable option, any commentator who criticized the transfer of work and jobs was demeaned for a diminished sense of reality; "smarten up!" Recently, Dagger and The Bean engaged in an exchange ( a Mutt and Jeff routine) about the financial prospects of Porter. It was like a PR-orchestrated exchange the intent of which was solely to diminish and potentially harm Porter. Surely the purpose of this forum is not to offer corporate interests an avenue for the use of shills to attack the competitors of their employers (or clients). Porter? PR Shill? Gimme a break. It's a stupid business plan that relies on an unsustainable monopoly situation at an airport. High costs and low fares is a business model that has never worked, and never will work. It brings a smile to my face when I hear Porter's fares are less than WJA's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagger Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Did I miss something? Since January, has ACTS transferred Winnipeg jobs to El Salvador? What exactly has been transferred to El Salvador? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 Did I miss something? Since January, has ACTS transferred Winnipeg jobs to El Salvador? What exactly has been transferred to El Salvador? During the travelling road show for ACTS, a VP was questioned on the outsourcing of ACTS work to El Salvador, his response was, how can you compete with their wages, the non licenced people are paid around $500 per month and the licenced are paid around $1200 per month, he went on to say that airframe will be a thing of the past in CANADA and that only component will remain and that ACTS wants to train the airframe people to work on component and of course with the associated drop in pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagger Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 During the travelling road show for ACTS, a VP was questioned on the outsourcing of ACTS work to El Salvador, his response was, how can you compete with their wages, the non licenced people are paid around $500 per month and the licenced are paid around $1200 per month, he went on to say that airframe will be a thing of the past in CANADA and that only component will remain and that ACTS wants to train the airframe people to work on component and of course with the associated drop in pay. You didn't answer my question either. Have any jobs been outsourced to El Salvador? We already knew that airframe work is doomed in Canada for cost reasons. But that didn't begin with El Salvador. You can send an aircraft to HAICO in Hong Kong and save big time. That option has existed, and has been used, by AC. Whether AC owned ACTS or a third party owns ACTS, this is a fact of life. Engine and component work is profitable. Some frame work can be retained as part of comprehensive contracts, but any airline is going to arbitrage its costs by doing some of its frame work in lower-cost countries. Whether this translates into base closures is highly questionable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 You didn't answer my question either. Have any jobs been outsourced to El Salvador? We already knew that airframe work is doomed in Canada for cost reasons. But that didn't begin with El Salvador. You can send an aircraft to HAICO in Hong Kong and save big time. That option has existed, and has been used, by AC. Whether AC owned ACTS or a third party owns ACTS, this is a fact of life. Engine and component work is profitable. Some frame work can be retained as part of comprehensive contracts, but any airline is going to arbitrage its costs by doing some of its frame work in lower-cost countries. Whether this translates into base closures is highly questionable. So you are suggesting that we close the barn door after the horses have left! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard Posted August 16, 2007 Share Posted August 16, 2007 So you are suggesting that we close the barn door after the horses have left! This is just an idea as I have no insight on this as I am only thinking that Jazz could and needs a central location for Heavy MTC and YWG would be a ideal for Jazz to run a heavy base. The YXU hangar is to small. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Lavoy Posted August 17, 2007 Share Posted August 17, 2007 dagger, it's been mentioned a couple of times recently that ACE won't exist in the not so distant future, what is likely to happen to the remaining 30% interest in ACTS and whatever interest it still has in its other subsidiaries? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conehead Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 You didn't answer my question either. Have any jobs been outsourced to El Salvador? Not yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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