Seeker Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 Wasn't this supposed to have something to do with seniority? You sure wouldn't know it from this report? 777s and 787s a'coming Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Powick Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 Wasn't this supposed to have something to do with seniority? You sure wouldn't know it from this report? It's not what was said in the article...it's what was not said...re more to come ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
better4me Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 Wasn't this supposed to have something to do with seniority? You sure wouldn't know it from this report? The pilot seniority issue and the disagreement over cost certainty on the 777/787 purchase were split up with the binding arbitration decision in September. AC has the cost certainty and OAC still doesn't have their wish of another kick at the seniority cat. Actually, from the cheap seats it looks like all that the OAC boys have accomplished is to neuter the whole pilot group from voting down more consessions from being introduced. Thanks OAC, you guys did a great job for the shareholders by reducing costs. Hope Milton can pass out larger dividend cheques at the AGM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockyc Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 Wasn't this supposed to have something to do with seniority? You sure wouldn't know it from this report? Well that's not the way I understood it. The issues were split into two parts: Part 1 - the 777/787 order and the Pilot agreements sought by AC to fly them. I believe ACPA Executive and AC came to some agreement on this which was put to a vote. The vote failed to pass. Part 1-B then came forward to settle the issues through binding arbitration. That seems to have taken place. Part 2 - a somewhat wierdly structured second (or is it third, fourth, or fifth?) re-look at Pilot senority issues. I didn't see anything that indicated that solutions to Part 2 were required before solutions to Part 1 came about. Isn't that why it was split into two parts in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dagger Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 Well that's not the way I understood it. The issues were split into two parts: Part 1 - the 777/787 order and the Pilot agreements sought by AC to fly them. I believe ACPA Executive and AC came to some agreement on this which was put to a vote. The vote failed to pass. Part 1-B then came forward to settle the issues through binding arbitration. That seems to have taken place. Part 2 - a somewhat wierdly structured second (or is it third, fourth, or fifth?) re-look at Pilot senority issues. I didn't see anything that indicated that solutions to Part 2 were required before solutions to Part 1 came about. Isn't that why it was split into two parts in the first place? Probably a good analysis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fido Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 The seniority component is due for the next hearing at the end of this week. In front of the same arbitrator Terplitsky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest directlaw Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 There may be two more meetings wrt seniority with Teplitsky. His target date is the 15 th for release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockyc Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 There may be two more meetings wrt seniority with Teplitsky. His target date is the 15 th for release. Given all I've read here in the past two years I think God him (or her) self could come down and give a final binding decision and it wouldn't make a whit of difference. Hard core groups would still rail, wail and moan about it until death catches up. Even then I expect pamphlets have already been printed to hand out at various wakes and memorial services detailing chapter and verse on how "we was robbed, back-stabbed and double-dealt". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 2, 2005 Share Posted November 2, 2005 There may be two more meetings wrt seniority with Teplitsky. His target date is the 15 th for release. My prediction is his report will be accepted reluctantly by the MAJORITY of the pilot group and this puppy will most likely be put to bed....finally! The CIRB will be more than happy to give their blessing and say goodbye to all those annoying airline pilots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 So the report is now out....Gee I think I should be charging $25 for my predictions...well at least I'll go buy a lottery ticket ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 Any details? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydee Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 Any details? Very minor gain's for OAC......if there was a vote to accept it.....my guess is that both sides would turn it down. Definitely a solution that everybody dislikes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 Interesting. When can the details be made public? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaydee Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 Probably when ACAP places another full page ad to explain why they are crying the blues. Rumour was they would be assessing each OCP an extra $1000 so they could sue AC & ACPA if anything got changed. I'm afraid the ending to this song has yet to be written. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moeman Posted November 14, 2005 Share Posted November 14, 2005 The ex-CAIL Component of CUPE has been begging their old members for money for years now too. Not sure what they're up to, but I know they're watching these proceedings quite closely. Funny thing is, the board seems to think Burkett's decision was probably as close to "fair" as you can get when merging two groups whose hiring patterns were so divergent, so I'm not sure what they hope to accomplish. DOH is a no-go, so........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Definitely a solution that everybody dislikes. That means it is the most reasonable solution for everyone. As I have said for a long time... the best solution will be the one where EVERYONE has to hold their nose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Doesn't sound too much like you and Jaydee are holding your noses. I drop 15% on system seniority, and I'm just over 50 numbers ahead of where Mitchnick stuck me (a list that even most of you held up as being overly punishing). From where I sit, this is Mitchnick with a cat toy to distract me. I hope the CIRB puts this piece of crap where it belongs: in the dumper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AIP Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Doesn't sound too much like you and Jaydee are holding your noses. I drop 15% on system seniority, and I'm just over 50 numbers ahead of where Mitchnick stuck me (a list that even most of you held up as being overly punishing). From where I sit, this is Mitchnick with a cat toy to distract me. I hope the CIRB puts this piece of crap where it belongs: in the dumper. 15 % from where Buzz ?? DOH ?? Mitchnick ??, or Keller, which Mr T. has commented he cannot understand where Keller was coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Keller, obviously. Like you couldn't figure that out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest long keel Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 This revised Keller award puts me at the same relative senority as I held 7 years ago. Am I pleased, no. Will I vote to accept this and move on, yes. I can live with this, and I'm burned out on the infighting. This is miles better than the Keller original award, but it is a far cry from Decision 183 which is what all parties had originally agreed to. In the interest of moving on I'll take the losses, and hope to hell all others will as well. I am willing to move on with award, not smiling but willing. An award that everyone hates is as close to fair as we will find imho. This may be that award. Bravo Mr. T. You made a bad situation tolerable, nobody could expect much more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Will I vote to accept this and move on, yes. Wasn't aware you could vote on your seniority. (Sound of the crapper flushing at the CIRB) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Will I vote to accept this and move on, yes. I am prepared to move on as well. Enough is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzz Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 I am prepared to move on as well. Enough is enough. Enough was enough with Keller. And still is. You guys basically have Mort's List back, and are trying to fake enough tears to be convincing. Sickening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kilo Mike Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 Get over yourself Buzz. It's no where near the Mitchnik list, and it's a far cry from D183. You want to vent ?? ... Fine .. Go for it. The bottom line is it splits Mitchnik and Keller and get's pretty darn close to putting folks in their per-merger relative seniority. No winners , or losers right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dropzone Posted November 15, 2005 Share Posted November 15, 2005 You guys basically have Mort's List back What planet are you on ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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