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Ac Hiring and Jazz pilots


Guest rance
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Guest rance

Does anyone know if AC is interviewing Jazz pilots and how many?I assume LOU18 is not valid (40% from Jazz).

Only 249 from Jazz applied and I would say 95% of that number is very jr. at Jazz so hopefully people at AC realise we are not part of the old battles with ACPA.

Thanks

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Rance:

I see that you have made several posts on this topic already. AC has interviewed, and is interviewing, many, many guys from Jazz. If you are a junior Jazz pilot and you haven't been called yet - relax - they'll get around to you. The 40% part of LOU 18 is not in effect but the other inducements are being continued by the corp.

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Guest rance

Thanks Seeker,

I'll make this my last post on the topic, but when you've worked this hard to get to the mainline, you do take an active interest in the process.

They actually haven't been interviewing much from Jazz and told someone in an interview last week they will be hiring only 1 Jazz pilot per groundschool, so was wondering if anyone had any other info. on the topic.

Apperantly it has had nothing to do with AC or ACPA, but Jazz mgmt. is really behind the training curve and doesn't want AC leaving them too short right now, but that could be a rumour.

Thanks

Rance

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Thanks Seeker,

All make this my last post on the topic, but when you've worked this hard to get to the mainline, you do take an active interest in the process.

They actually haven't been interviewing much from Jazz and told someone in an interview last week they will be hiring only 1 Jazz pilot per groundschool, so was wondering if anyone had any other info. on the topic.

Apperantly it has had nothing to do with AC or ACPA, but Jazz mgmt. is really behind the training curve and doesn't want AC leaving them too short right now, but that could be a rumour.

Thanks

Rance

Rance:

AC wants to hire the best candidates they can find and Jazz pilots compare very favorably with the OTS candidates. Jazz management may have asked AC management to consider the effects that a large-scale hiring would have on their operations - I don't know if this is true but I'll allow that it's possible. This may be true and it may also be true that AC has chosen to hold back hiring Jazz pilots for a month or two until the training at Jazz has caught up. This is the same "courtesy" that would prevent AC from hiring a whole whack of guys from Bearskin or Georgian at the same time. In any case, Jazz predicts that they'll be up to speed by the end of Sept. In the meanwhile; work on paying off the line of credit, collect your letters of reference, get the suit pressed etc, etc.

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Guest woxof

As someone who has never applied to Air Canada but flies as a passenger, I say to the Jazz pilots....step in line and compete against all the other qualified candidates. I want my flight crew to be the best for the job, not someone who was chosen because of where they worked. If I were a shareholder i.e. owner of the company, I would say...also balance that with expenses. Why create more training by hiring from the connectors. Isn't that twice as expensive per newhire?

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.The sr. members at Jazz don't give a s**t about the lower ranks...

I don't that is a fair statement at all. I think it might be fair to say the senior guys (or infact the 80% of the Jazz pilots who haven't 'applied') don't give a s**t about the very small minority of whiny people. Those who have no interest in working for Jazz, or with the people that work there, or the long or short term prospects of Jazz. Yes I think that would be a fair statement. Us don't give a s**ter's are looking forward to the day you leave. So good luck with that interview biggrin.gif

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"I call "BS". This guy, Thrust Set, is just trying to get everyone riled up. "

I agree with you on this one, I think we are trying to relate the lawsuit somehow to the lack of hiring (and remember it has only been one course) from Jazz. Ending the AO lawsuit was one of the three conditions for the failure of the Global Solution between ACPA and ALPA and not any ulterior motive for AC management not to hire from Jazz. I believe it has something to do with the shortage of pilots at Jazz, hence the OT being waved in our faces.

biggrin.gif

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Guest woxof

"They are hiring some with 2000 t.t .It has nothing to do with qualified, but all to do with politics, so as a result you aren't always getting the best qualified."

That's unfortunate. But two wrongs don't make a right. I hope in the future all politics are cast aside with regard to hiring. Although a 2,000 hour t.t. pilot could be the best qualified, all things considered.

"If you hired a Jazz cpt making $100,000/year and replaced him with a new hire making $35,000 you could off set training cost."

Since when do new hires replace a captain?

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I want my flight crew to be the best for the job, not someone who was chosen because of where they worked.

The Jazz pilots already work for Air Canada and are no less qualified than main line pilots. The difference is that they belong to a separate seniority list and are therefor covered by a different collective agreement.

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And it simply continues. One pilot group opposed to or by another based primarily upon a hierarchical notion of the aviation world. The "junior" Jazz who was persuaded that the "road to mainline" was best travelled by seeking employment with a "feeder" believes that his/her career aspirations are frustrated by the dinosaurs; the mainline pilot who bought into the same notion and therefore believes that ALL regional pilots are "inferior" in terms of status.

How quickly each group forgets the history that has dictated the mind-set of their predecessors.

If the OAC could, at law, avoid Keller by creating a new association/union ----they would. If mainline believed that "their" flying was going to Jazz and that "their" jobs would be protected by a seniority list merger (Global Solution) --the lawsuit would be irrelevant --they'd be in line. Evidence? That's when the events leading to Picher become compelling reading. Trite statement--those who don't or won't learn from history are destined to repeat it.

Were it not for the AO lawsuit, there's a very good chance (probability) that those junior Jazz pilots now fretting that their career aspirations have been frustrated by the "seniors" would in fact not have a job.

Fact is---there are no doubt some Jazz pilots who would have declined the alleged "move up" available under Picher because they were quite content with the flying they had enjoyed through most of the years of their projected career.

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I was referring to lawsuit that certain members of Jazz are engaged in.They don't give a s$#T how that impacts relations with ACPA, which is fine for them, but don't drag everyone down with you.

The action of a few private individuals that happen to be employed by Jazz (I'm not one by the way) were a direct reaction to the actions of certain AC pilots. So thank the AC pilots for the disservice if you're looking for a goat. The fact is that the lawsuit issue has nothing to do with AC hiring. ACPA just likes to blow a lot of smoke. Either that or they are cronically confused. I suppose if they could conect the dots between a 777/787 order and seniority, these guys can draw lines connecting all sorts of unrealted issues. The fact is that the lawsuit has nothing to do with your job hunt. Your new friends just like to perpetuate the hate. Sad but true. sad.gif

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senior Jazz

user posted image

"Picher"

That's really cute. My daughter used to have the same web board skills but she's older now (19) and just doesn't seem to care.

I care about my profession and the damage ACPA has done. But keep up with the little cartoony things if that is what makes it hum for you.

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"This one is simple. Union = Unity .

ACPA = DIS unity. "

The majority of MEC's are composed of sr. members, who may have different interests than  a jr. member.It's like a mini government, sure there is an "election",but alot of power is wielded by a few and if they have an issue from the past it affects all.

Absolutely not. The ALPA structure is far more condusive to represent the junior/senior demography, We elect status reps. 50% of the vote at the MEC level has to come from F/O's. That is not the the ACPA reality.

Careful what you wish for. You may get it

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woxof

"someone who has never applied to Air Canada but flies as a passenger, I say to the Jazz pilots....step in line and compete against all the other qualified candidates."

Not much wrong with your statement but, as a pax and with all due respect Sir; you clearly don't have any appreciation for the dynamics of seniority list development. I will provide an example below.

"I want my flight crew to be the best for the job, not someone who was chosen because of where they worked."

You should be aware that the OAC list is ripe with persons hired based on nepotism and equity hiring programs etc. You will not often find a "best candidate" for the job in those senario's.

"If I were a shareholder i.e. owner of the company, I would say...also balance that with expenses. Why create more training by hiring from the connectors. Isn't that twice as expensive per newhire"

You are right on the mark with this one!

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I want my flight crew to be the best for the job, not someone who was chosen because of where they worked.

When you buy a ticket on Air Canada, who exactly do you think is flying the plane? In many cases, it is NOT an Air Canada pilot.

Welcome to the real world.

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"If I were a shareholder i.e. owner of the company, I would say...also balance that with expenses. Why create more training by hiring from the connectors. Isn't that twice as expensive per newhire"

You are right on the mark with this one!

Right on the mark? I don't think so. Look, it's been explained here many times already - taking a Captain or even a senior FO from Jazz leaves an opening that is filled by someone who will be paid less than they were. In addition to this the pay at AC is likely less than that person was receiving at Jazz. More to the point though is the ethical aspect of this. Most large corporations have a policy that vacancies must be offered internally before hiring outside. What are the long term financial implications of refusing to allow career progression within the employee group? Would you really argue that this is cost effective?

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