Aerospace jobs go begging (AME's)

[Lazionic]

http://www.canada.com/montreal/montrealgaz...5f-3d1abccb7601

Aerospace jobs go begging

Sector's troubles scare off students; 'In September 2001, we had 1,200 students - today, we have 150,' school director says

FRANCOIS SHALOM

The Gazette

December 17, 2004

The constant spectre of bankruptcy and/or layoffs at Air Canada and Bombardier Inc. during the last few years has scared off Quebec students who used to pursue careers in the formerly coveted aerospace sector - which is consequently seeking 1,161 people urgently, and will need to fill 3,000 posts by the end of 2005.

The Centre d'adaptation de la main d'oeuvre aerospatiale au Quebec (CAMAQ) unveiled a survey yesterday that estimates that in addition to the immediate demand for nearly 1,200 qualified people right now, there will be 1,133 positions to fill next year. With the normal three-per-cent attrition rate - retirements, career changes and other departures - there will be about 3,000 aviation positions available.

CAMAQ president Serge Tremblay said they will all be filled, and that there's currently no serious shortage.

But the shortage "will come in six months, a year, or three," he added. "Call the (aerospace training) schools, and you'll see that students are simply not entering the field any more."

Josee Peloquin, director of the Ecole des metiers de l'aerospatiale de Montreal, could not agree more.

"In September 2001, we had 1,200 students, and the school operated 24 hours a day on four shifts," she said. "Today, we have 150 students. It's dramatic."

Lucie Cousineau agreed, saying she also has never seen the pipeline so dry.

"On Sept. 11, (2001), we had 1,550 students," said the director of the ecole nationale d'aerotechnique in St. Hubert. "Last September, we had 806 - about half."

The slump is not part of the normal peaks and valleys of the highly cyclical aerospace industry, Cousineau said.

"We've never seen an impact of this magnitude. Young people have deserted aerospace training en masse."

Tremblay and Cousineau said news reports about problems at Montreal's two largest aviation companies, Air Canada and Bombardier, do not help, giving the impression that the industry is collapsing.

The "truly frightening" aspect, Cousineau said, is the response they get when conducting workshops at schools across the province.

"We tell them most people aren't laid off, that there's a recovery under way, that aviation will always be in growth. But our message just falls flat. Their parents, teachers and career counsellors keep warning them about Air Canada and Bombardier."

Unlike a few years ago, when they played to packed classrooms, "the kids don't even come to the information sessions we do any more."

Tremblay said many layoffs at Bombardier have been announced for later, but even those employees will not be available for many of the jobs that will be needed in the future.

"They're by and large structural assemblers - and they're often on a recall list" and may balk at getting paid $12 an hour at a smaller firm, or about half of what they earned at Bombardier.

Danys Therrien is one of those on the firing line.

The quality-control manager of Exeltech, a growing aircraft repair-and-overhaul company that maintains discount-airline Jetsgo's fleet, said "four years ago, when we started, we were swamped with job requests."

"Now, we have to place a lot of ads," Therrien said. "And truth be told, we also have to lower our standards a bit - expand the job definition to include people who are perhaps not as well-qualified."

That presents no danger to the flying public, he said, because the highly regulated aviation standards remain the same. But it means companies have to spend a lot more to train people to the appropriate level.

"Ideally, we'd like people who can hit the ground running, with a short learning curve. But we're finding we have to do a lot of basic training - people who are not conversant with basic systems and terminology."

But Pratt & Whitney Canada spokesperson Annick Laberge said her company has no trouble finding personnel. "We've hired about 400 people this year, and expect to hire 100 people in 2005 and another 100 in 2006."

Therrien said that disparity is easily accounted for: as sponsors, Pratt & Whitney and Bombardier have major input in the training students receive at the schools, equipping them with skills appropriate for their needs but not for the requirements of small and medium-size firms.

"You'd think that when things are bad at Bombardier, the entire sector is bad," Tremblay said. "That's not accurate. Bombardier may be the big brother of the family, with a broken leg. But the family is in good health."

After the daily diet of layoffs and cutbacks, Bombardier Aerospace still employs 12,000 people in Montreal, he added, only 3,000 off the peak of a few years ago.

fshalom@thegazette.canwest.com

[AME]

I don't find it at all suprising considering the pay and working conditions, in fact I see this as a good thing (supply and demand).

Now if the AC guys/gals (they set the industry standard) would ever get their poop in a group, and got dedicated representation for it's licenced trades you might just see a difference in the future

[Lazionic]

I believe this only the begining of what is going to happen in the next 5 to 10 years. There are many employees on the verge of retiring without any new employees to replace them . There is going to be mass shortage of AME's. The pay is not really attractive at all with the amount of responsibility one has to take on. There are much better jobs that pay about the same amount with better shifts and less responsiblity. I think you have it right when you say "supply and demand", only then will aviation companies start paying AME's more.

As you know we at AC are hoping to get our act together but it seems it is going at a snails pace to get anywhere.

[AME]

As you know we at AC are hoping to get our act together but it seems it is going at a snails pace to get anywhere.

If you're talking about CAMA it is a step in the right direction, however they insist on including non-licenced trades in the same bargaining unit

oops, I pulled a Mitch

[Lazionic]

Yes i was refering to CAMA. I am unsure as to why they want the non-licenced trades in this organization. Many of the non-licenced trades have no interest in being with this union. I still have a faint hope that something will come of trying to get this union, whether it be a new union or better representation from our current union.

[mrlupin]

Good day Lazionic,

My name is Eric Veilleux,and as you have probably seen on the CAMA web site,I am the eastern Region Director for CAMA.

I will try to give you a really short explanation of why all maintenance trades are included in CAMA.

The Air Canada Inspectors and Certified Aircraft Technicians (CATs)tried to seperate from the IAM in the early eighties. Their attempt did not work because it was perceived (by the CIRB) as elitism. Aircraft Maintenance Engineers are not recognised as a professional trade. If you go to labour Canada,you will see us listed as semi skilled labour or something of the sort. That makes having a national association very dificult. I don't beleive the the CIRB would recognise an association for all AMEs like they do for accoutants and such other trades. That makes it much harder for us to gain recognition.

CAMA seeks to represent all maintenance employees at Air Canada. That is what was decided from the start.I understand that many people would love to see a AME association representing us nationaly but at present time...the only such representation you can get is with the various(Ontario,Quebec,Western) AME associations.

Eric

[AME]

The Air Canada Inspectors and Certified Aircraft Technicians (CATs)tried to seperate from the IAM in the early eighties

That was twenty years ago, times might just have changed

Aircraft Maintenance Engineers are not recognised as a professional trade

Neither are Pilots, Flight Attendants or CSAs yet they all seem to have their own representation

CAMA seeks to represent all maintenance employees at Air Canada

Like I said, a step in the right direction, but still along way from what is needed

the only such representation you can get is with the various(Ontario,Quebec,Western) AME associations.

Have you noticed what they, along with Camc, has done to our licence over the last 5-7 years